Just to give you something to talk about this morning, the following is a little snippet from Winston Churchill’s famous “we’ll fight on the beaches” speech he delivered to Parliament on June 4th, 1940, in the immediate aftermath of the surprisingly successful evacuation of the British Expeditionary Forces at Dunkirk:
We have found it necessary to take measures of increasing stringency, not only against enemy aliens and suspicious characters of other nationalities, but also against British subjects who may become a danger or a nuisance should the war be transported to the United Kingdom. I know there are a great many people affected by the orders which we have made who are the passionate enemies of Nazi Germany. I am very sorry for them, but we cannot, at the present time and under the present stress, draw all the distinctions which we should like to do. If parachute landings were attempted and fierce fighting attendant upon them followed, these unfortunate people would be far better out of the way, for their own sakes as well as for ours. There is, however, another class, for which I feel not the slightest sympathy. Parliament has given us the powers to put down Fifth Column activities with a strong hand, and we shall use those powers subject to the supervision and correction of the House, without the slightest hesitation until we are satisfied, and more than satisfied, that this malignancy in our midst has been effectively stamped out.
I want to point out that the bulk of this speech discussed the recent military disasters that led up to Dunkirk and the prospect of an imminent invasion of the British homeland. This was not in reaction to the terrifying tactics of the Nazi occupation forces in Paris. By the end of June, the Battle of Britain commenced, and the cities of England were under withering aerial attack.
Note that Churchill wasn’t proud or boastful about the need, as he saw it, to round up suspicious characters and foreigners. Note, also, that the threat we was warning about was as real as a heart attack.
Finally, note that we here in America later had cause to regret that panic had led us to overreact in our treatment of Japanese-Americans. See George Takei of Star Trek fame (who lived in various internment camps as a child) for more on that.
This speech is remembered mainly for its stirring conclusion in which Churchill rallied the British at their direst moment to the challenge of a long war to liberate the world from fascism. He didn’t encourage the British to cower in fear. Would that Republican candidates for the presidency could say something like this:
I have, myself, full confidence that if all do their duty, if nothing is neglected, and if the best arrangements are made, as they are being made, we shall prove ourselves once again able to defend our Island home, to ride out the storm of war, and to outlive the menace of tyranny, if necessary for years, if necessary alone. At any rate, that is what we are going to try to do. That is the resolve of His Majesty’s Government-every man of them. That is the will of Parliament and the nation. The British Empire and the French Republic, linked together in their cause and in their need, will defend to the death their native soil, aiding each other like good comrades to the utmost of their strength.
Again, he didn’t say that no bombs would go off and they’d never have another setback. He said that he had confidence in his people, in the government, in their plans, and in their prospects for success.
That’s how you show leadership in a crisis.
Amen! Well said BooMan …
Unfortunately for the British, the military strength of Germany with it’s Blitzkrieg was quite impressive. Europe was caught unprepared for war after the Great Depression. The BBC radio broadcasts, the sound of the Big Ben at the start of a news bulletin and the wprds of Churchill kept all over Europe hope alive as the SS boots trampled on people, freedom and livelyhood. Of course there is no comparison whatsoever with the position of the U.S. today.
The spectacle between the presidential candidates in the race for the White House can best be described as ultimate cowardice. Bush build his coalition to go to war in Iraq of fear … fear has never left the American people. Look at the growth of Islamophobia, ugly racism, bigotry and just FEAR. I have no words for it.
Israel under Netanyahu has been leading the way!
○ WSJ Publishes Israel’s Leading Stone-Cold Arab-Killer, former US citizen Naftali Bennett
○ Ayaan Hirsi Ali: take lessons from Israel
yes, the USA lacks the moral stature of Great Britain. tiresome
UPDATE 2: Suspected mastermind of Paris attacks Abaaoud died in police raid : prosecutor | The Guardian | plus France24
Yesterday’s info was correct. The news circulated in Belgian press and social media. The source was IS expert Van Ostade who had received info from two French police investigators and was analyzed on jihadists websites … bits of information circulating.
Posted as update in my dairy – Mastermind Abaaoud Killed: Shootout In St. Denis North of Paris [Update].
One presumes that our conservatives would point out that Churchill was willing to do the “round up” necessary to protect the nation, while Tyrant Obammy wants to allow more (child) fifth columnists to enter!
Our historical roller coaster is back in business, with America’s Fascist Party now extolling WWII internment camps. Yes indeed, torture, internment camps, and refusal to help hapless non-Christian refugees just like the 30s, anything that once was regarded as a national disgrace in American history is now an example of our exceptional virtue as a nation. That’s “conservatism”!
yes; know anecdotally of Austrian Jewish refugee [young man] escaping to Britain spending the war in internment camp in Canada. is anything written about this?
As long as they did not blow up horses, Londoners went about their business undeterred by IRA bombings. Very phlegmatic.
I have a question that is I guess a bit cold-blooded. But does the US really have to do -anything- about ISIS?
Are they a threat of any nontrivial size to us? They killed 150 people in France, but even if they’d killed them the US, that’s just not very many people. It’s horrible, and tragic, and I’m not saying otherwise. But in terms of national security … it’s a pinprick, isn’t it?
I understand that emotionally, 150 (or even 3000) people being slaughtered by fanatics is far worse than 100/day dying in car crashes, and I understand that many (most?) of the proposed responses will probably make things worse, but setting that aside … just in terms of the coldest calculations, is this a big deal? If it were politically feasible, would largely ignoring the attacks not be the wisest purely rational response?
You raise a Q that has crossed my mind. OTOH, I think the overarching issue is not that it’s “just 150 people” (and yes, I am deeply sorry for that loss), but that allegedly such actions could continue with ongoing loss of life and damage to property. All very random, as well. So not that easy to predict and prepare for.
Kind of like how the westernized allied forces have killed 100s of thousands in the ME and destroyed a lot of “stuff” there, but hey! Why mention that fact?
I said the other day: sow the wind, reap the whirlwind. I don’t agree with these actions taken in Paris by Daesch or whomever, but really, how and why did this all begin? And who’s ultimately responsible for it starting up in the first place? And so on…
I’m not sure if there’s really any such thing as ‘ultimate responsibility’–and if there is, I doubt the human capacity to identify it. (And certainly to agree about it.)
I don’t know. I guess you’re right that ‘stopping them before they do it again’ is the point, and that’s why all the arguments about if Plan A actually strengthens them, and if Plan B will work, etc.
But even so, I wonder if the best way to stop them isn’t just not really responding. First, because they could do this once a month, and it wouldn’t threaten us as a country. Well, just that, really. It’s not way to ‘stop’ them, but an acceptance of the damage that they do, like cars and guns and smoking. This the world we live in.
(My second argument for non-response as a way to stop them would’ve been because they -want- a response, that’s the whole point. So maybe the way to disincentivize their actions is by doing what they -don’t- want, not by doing what they -do- want. But that’s a whole different point.)
Yes but we here in these Yew Nighted States have been told endlessly that ISIS/ISIL/Daesch is a-comin’ ta GIT US big time bc they hate us for our freedumbs ‘n such. I heard it on the radio, so it must be true! It was on NPR, after all!!
Ergo, yes, this is Yuuuge threat to us here in the USA. We must sh*t in our pants, cower in abject fear, utter racist, bigoted statements, and throw money at the Morlock, er, the MIC.
Lather, rinse, repeat.
Steggies…
The problem is not so much with “150 dead,” tragic as that may be. Nor was it even with the much more serious 9/11 attacks. The problem…the real, desired result of such attacks…lies in the eventual short-circuiting of a fairly well-functioning society.
Drive a society rightward towards its own worst tendencies and you have stopped it from functioning in the manner that brought it to greatness. Then keep up the pressure until it implodes.
And that is where we are at now as a country…teetering on the brink of of a colossal rightward fall. If that happens, ISIS will have won.
There is a thin line between a true war footing and all out fascism. Churchill successfully walked that line, as did FDR. My question is…where is our Churchill? I don’t see one appearing. Certainly not any of the Republicans, and I don’t think either Bernie Sanders or HRC fill the bill either. HRC is the most likely choice just because she is as “professional” a national politician as was Churchill. She knows the game and she knows where and how to pull the levers.
But will she?
I have my doubts.
So do about one half of the American people, apparently.
We shall see.
Soon enough.
AG
Well Winney was good some of the time at leadership, and that speech is certainly worth referencing. Of course, the UK/France, etc, faced enemies who were mostly self-created (albeit Hitler was aided and abetted by the US Banks and Grandpappy Bush, but I digress), not exactly created by UK/France, etc.
This time, this mess is mostly directly attributable to actions taken – more recently – by the USA and our fellow travelers in the name of something or other but mostly about Oil and making money and hegemony and imperialistic hubris, etc.
Not that the two preceding WW’s didn’t have aspects of that as well.
Now we face a self-created enemy, and our so-called “leaders” on the purported “conservative” side of the aisle do nothing but goad and push their brainwashed minions to be pants-sh*tting cowards who are thrilled by the prospect of dissing the Blah Usurper in their “WHITE” house.
Frankly, it’s hard to take any of it seriously except that is so serious. And sadly, I fear the beat down will go on. And it won’t be coming from 5 year old Syrians.
But everything, imo, is going exactly to the plan as our Oligarchs (or some segment of them) want it. More money for the gaping maw of the MIC, the guns ‘n ammo industries, and frankly, more useless eaters – from anywhere on the planet – mowed down in cold blood. What’s not to like?
Am I cynical enough yet?
Maybe Godwin should be expanded to include all references to WWII.
I know Americans were so proud of and loved that war that we’ve been trying for seventy years to replicate it even if the identified enemy is a gang of thugs with no state and without the huge resources required to create a military machine. There will always be people, for whatever irrational reason they concoct, that delight in slaughtering people that have done them no harm. McVeigh, Brevik, Atta, etc. There are many more that fantasize about doing so but lack the means and opportunity to do it, but may be within the population that inflicts violence on those they know.
btw – only west coast Japanese-Americans were interned. It wasn’t a fear that gripped the entire nation (not even Hawaii) and nobody called for the internment of German-Americans that probably in much higher numbers supported Nazi-Germany than Japanese-Americans supported WWII Japan. It was the assets and livelihoods of Japanese-Americans that some “good white folks” wanted that facilitated the calls for the internment camps. And fear. Theft and fear, continuing features of the American psyche.
Japanese-American internment probably a result of racism too: Germans from Europe and Japanese from Asia.
Little in this country doesn’t have a racist component. However, only Japanese-Americans on the west coast were rounded up and Japanese-Americans were allowed to serve in the WWII military — Daniel Inouye.
The respective strategic bombing doctrines in the ETO (daylight precision) vs Japan (night area).
Here’s an idea: Let’s round up the Irish because of the IRA. C’mon. This has grown to absurdity. They’ll pass this “pause” (of indeterminate length) for a small group of people without even expanding the visa requirements for the French or English or Germans or Belgians, etc. who can just get on a plane and come into this country with no check whatsoever (except perhaps the no-fly list). A lot of good that’ll do.
No kidding. Famous crook Whitey Bulger was even known by the Fibbies to be running arms for the IRA. Well to my recollection (pretty unreliable), I don’t think the IRA did anything here.
But let’s get real:
IRA = white cousins
ISIS = brown skinned scary scary fear fear others
So, there’s that.
It’s bogus, hocus pocus, let’s give all our money to the MIC because safety blah blah blah.
I agree with Obama. We are afraid of three year old babies. We want to send them all back whence they came. What then? We will have more enemies.
No one talks about the utter destruction this war has put upon the people in the ISIL lands. Their homeland and means of economic survival have been destroyed along with many of their family and friends. And the people have endured years of drought and millions of displaced peoples as well. Is it any wonder they hate us? And that word may not express their contempt for us.
And ISIL is surrounded by Arab countries who sympathize and supply arms. They want Assad defeated, not ISIL. They do nothing constructive and leave it to us. At least now Russia has brought some clarity to the situation, and Bernie Sanders at least mentioned climate change. More drought will make the world situation even worse.
So now the clown car, to include Hillary, Trump the Magnificent and Morning Joe, want to make more war and turn away the babies. Smart move. Create more terrorists. But what will we do to ease the pain of the people there, once we “win”, if anything at all? Or will this simply be perpetual war?
Here’s the relevant lesson from WWII:
https:/www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/11/17/what-americans-thought-of-jewish-refuge
es-on-the-eve-of-world-war-ii
Yes, and this:
http://www.traces.org/germaninternees.html
and Britain, see my question upthread
instance I know of, refugee sent immediately to Canada