Floridagal’s diary “You have already started to change the party, together we have transformed this race. “ (apparently promoted to front page status from the diaries by susanhu) is essentially an appreciation of Howard Dean’s work as DNC chairman. I am a Dean supporter, and would have been only too happy to see him start a third party when he was media-assassinated out of contention for the 2004 nomination.
But he did not. He stayed inside and worked.
And it is beginning to be apparent to me that he has not succeeded, that the swing to the right in the U.S. is well past the point of no return and that we are, as the perfectly accurate and colorful country American saying has it, shit outta luck here.
In that diary, floridagal quoted Mr. Dean as having said in February of 2004 :
He knew the odds, even then.
And he made his bet.
I think that it was the wrong bet.
I thought so then, and subsequent events have only proven my point.
My answer to floridagal’s post follows.
I think Howard Dean made a mistake. And I think that he is both beginning to REALIZE that mistake, and that he knows that he is now stuck with it. He COULD have started a third party the moment he realized what was up. The moment the PermaGov “ARRRGH”-ed him out of contention because they were afraid he would not play ball. The momentum of his run would have carried a new party thirty yards up the field, and although it would probably have lost the election, when the utter ineptitude and weakness of the Democratic Party became evident through the lens of hindsight he and his party would have been in GREAT position for the 2006 + 2008 races.
But he he did not…and we suffered through that ridiculous Boston convention and the ludicrously stupid Kerry lateral run that eventually went absolutely nowhere. Dean acceded to that farce, and it was a mistake.
He could have started a third party when it became clear that the Democratic powers-that-be…INCLUDING the crew over at the Daily Kos…absolutely refused to stand up and fight the results of the plainly stolen 2004 election. Because they were afraid of losing. Which ENSURED that they would lose even MORE. And also…BET on it…because many of them were told by their real handlers that it would be “bad for the country”. PermaGov-ese for “Lay off or we will yank your chain so hard that you will end up clerking in a 7-11 somewhere.”
But…he didn’t. He is a mainstream politician, after all, albeit a very good, honest and innovative one, and he went with the flow. That’s his job.
And it ain’t working.
Right now…with all of the bad things that have happened to BushCo, with all of the bad things that are happening to this country, I would not lay 4 to 1 odds that a Democratic majority will appear in either house of the US legislature over the next four years or so, nor would I even lay THOSE odds that we will have a Democratic President in 2008.
And the odds would balloon more like 100 to 1 if they included some sort of proviso that said legislatures and/or President would be in any way independent of the same corporate forces and power structures that are running the government at the present time.
BushCo Lite is the BEST that can be hoped for.
So it goes…
Starting another party would quite possibly ALSO have been a mistake, but it would at least have been taking a real shot at changing things if it worked. The Democratic Party…large and very powerful portions of it it, without a doubt..is NOT going to change, because it is owned lock, stock and barrel by the PermaGov. By big business. It will POSE as if it is changing…just like the media that is owned by the same interests poses at providing “fair and balanced coverage” of the news. But when push comes to shove, there will be Dean and his ideas, forever”ARRRGH”-ed out of effective contention just like the token liberal commentators disappear from the networks at the first fog of war talk or voter fraud obfuscation when the real deal marching orders come down from above. Just like the Judith Millers and William Safires will always be a main and dominant component of the NY Times.
Owned.
Lock, stock and barrel.
Like I said…so it goes.
Dean paid his money and he took his chances.
And I think that he has lost.
Too bad.
A good man.
He could’a been a contender.
But now he’s just another promoter.
Working for the Man.
As are ALL of us who accede to the weak, contemptible actions or “our” party.
Too bad.
We could’a been contenders.
I really think that is is too late now, barring some last minute miracle.
Too late for a third party, and too late to reform the Democratic party.
Only a successful Hail Mary pass from someone like Patrick Fitzgerald will do the trick given present circumstances.
Or some sort of intel/military coup d’etat. Which would probably end up worse than what we’ve got now. (You KNOW that there are people considering this, right? You KNOW that there are powerful people who think that this war is unwinnable and that our present course and positions are totally untenable. Don’t you? They are not ALL dummies in the Pentagon and at Langley. It’s been done before…)
A nasty situation.
I’ll tell you this…I am through with the Democratic Party, myself.
Go Green, and go down fighting if need be.
Give me reason, or give me death.
I am through with this other bullshit.
Later…
AG
The usual.
Recs, etc…
AG
P.S. And look!!!
I didn’t say NEWSTRIKE!!! even once!!!
(Oops!! I guess I just did. Nevermind…)
So…to my surprise I find this diary:
1-On the recommended list.
and
2-Totally uncommented upon. (As of Thursday afternoon.)
Interesting…
I wonder why.
I really do.
Is it just too self-evident to need comment?
So off the wall that people are speechless?
Or what?
Like I said…interesting.
AG
Congratulations. I could tell when I posted my post last night that no one agreed.
You win for now. Why do you win? Because a bunch of words on the internet easily wins out for the moment over feet on the ground fighting locally. Those words on the internet will destroy a lot and do a lot of harm, but the feet on the ground grunt work will some day prevail.
Now tell me, what is it you won? What victory have you won? What group is going to stand up for you at all?
Did you know Pelosi held the House together today, and Blunt’s little boys only got the vote through by 2 points?
But that is another issue.
floridagal.
“I” have won NOTHING.
Despite the nasty tone of your reply, floridagal, I hope that most of us here are past that.
What I would LIKE to see won is this country won back again. At least to the point that it has been won in other times, as shallow as THOSE wins have been when matched against an ideal and truly free democracy.
And my perception at the moment…actually, for most of the last 40 years…is that the Democratic Party is not a sufficient instrument to EFFECT that winning.
Disagree with me as you must…but please, look at the record.
The Democratic Party has been the loser for the vast majority of the last 40 years in national politics. Especially in the executive branch. It has shared the same fate as the Washington Generals playing against the Harlem Globetrotters in Abe Saperstein’s brilliant dumbshow invention, which predated OTHER institutionalized, wink wink, nudge nudge “But ain’t it GRAND entertainment???” fix systems such as the World Wrestling Federation, Reality TV and the Great American Political Soap Opera.
Only…it AIN’T grand entertainment, it is going to be our collective ASSES if we do not do something and do it damned soon.
Fuck Pelosi AND Blunt.
You want blunt?
I got yer blunt right here.
They are ALL on the corporate take.
MOST OF THEM WOULD SELL YOU OUT IN A SPLIT SECOND IF PUSH CAME TO SHOVE.
And HAVE done so, a hundred times over.
Under cover of “electability”.
And/or in the dead of night in some back room.
INCLUDING Nancy Pelosi.
You want someone who will “stand up” for me?
AND for you?
Convince Howard Dean to either start another party or move to one that is already established…the Green Party immediately comes to MY mind…and insist that it be funded by the public.
Grassroots/netroots style.
It can be done.
Maybe it’s not too late.
But I doubt it.
I think that we are already in overtime, here, and the contemporary Kristallnacht squad is calling the plays for the opposition.
So condescend me no condescensions, floridagal.
If your feet are in on the ground but planted in quicksand, the moment of truth approaches just that much faster.
And maybe…just MAYBE…some words on the internet might do some good.
It is said that Paul Revere ‘s ride, a single man on a single horse, prevented the success of an attack by the British that could have changed the entire course of history.
Well.,..there are a LOT of us on the ride today, and maybe people will listen THIS time as well.
I certainly hope so, because you so-called “feet on the ground” people…also popularly known as “reality-based” on the Big Yellow Blog (Or is it Orange…??? I’ll stick with yellow, myself.) have not done much of a job so far.
Time for a new party.
Time to go whole hog plus postage.
You want MY feet on the ground? The way they were when there seemed to be at least a possibility that Howard Dean had a real shot? Before I clearly saw the handwriting on the NY Times wall in late summer of 2003, that they were going to off Dean and force Small k kerry on us? The way they were when Eugene McCarthy and Bobby Kennedy were kicking ass and taking names?
Show me a viable party or candidate that is saying the right things.
One that I do not think is in on the scam.
Until then…words is all I’ve GOT.
And I’m using them
Later…
AG
floridagal, I read your post carefully as well as all the comments following. Although not all agree, your words were not wasted. Some will leave the party. They must follow their own paths. Some will leave permanently, others not. Only time will tell. But you must not be deterred from what you deem to be the best path for you. Continue with the efforts you have made. (As for me, I don’t believe that it is too late but that we are at a critical juncture. I believe that Dr.Dean needs to address the large blogs directly, as Senator Kerry and others have done recently. It is curious that he hasn’t yet, given his previous use of the internet for support.)
Perhaps Howard Dean has been READING the blogs…especially Big Yellow…and concurs with my own take that they are hopelessly lost in the mire of their own dreams.
The fact that Senator Small k kerry has seen fit to have directly addressed the blogs only goes to prove what I am saying.
If that craven son of a bitch…and I mean that, because he folded under every pressure the Rats laid on him, especially the Swift Boat thing and even MORE especially regarding the stolen election… feels that “the blogs” are a safe place to flog his stale wares, then you KNOW that they have lost their juice and are just another set of well-functioning parts in an outdated and totally ineffectual Democratic Party machine.
That’s the view from where I am standing these days, anyway.
I am by no means alone in this stance, and I predict that I will be LESS alone as the reality of the depths that the whole Democratic Party…and so-called “left blog world”, as well…has really descended becomes progressively clear to more and more people.
We shall see…
AG
Of course another possibility is that they’ve realized that utilization of the large blogs is an efficient way to address much of the base. BTW, with reference to your post, it will only be too late when they’ve rounded us up in concentration centers.
please check your email…
Old joke.
Tonto (“Fool”‘ en espanol) and The Lone Ranger are surrounded by hostile Indians.
Lone Ranger: What’ll we DO, Tonto?
Tonto: Who “we”, Kemo Sabé?
You write: “…with reference to your post, it will only be too late when they’ve rounded us up in concentration centers.”
Well…who “us”, Kemo Sabé?
They only have to round up the ones who cannot be properly “socialized”.
Because of their genetic predispositions, because of their position in society, because of their language strengths and weaknesses (language being the tool which is primarily used to create the trance state in which most Americans live), because of their upbringing, because of any and all combinations and permutations of these factors.
Visited Attica recently, boran 2?
Sing Sing?
And all the REST of the prisons of America?
Think all of those black and Hispanic prisoners are just misfits? If so…why the racial disparity? You are left with only two possible conclusions.
1-People of African and South/Central/Caribbean/Native American descent are somehow genetically inferior in their ability to socialize.
Or
2-Their position in this society PRECLUDES their so-called “socialization” in some large percentage.
I know which one I believe. (Hint: It ain’t #1.)
Well…there is a NEW underclass abuilding here.
And YOU’RE IT.
Ask not for whom the siren tolls.
Soon enough…it tolls for thee.
And THEN who ya gonna call?
The Democrats?
You bettah off with Ghostbusters.
BET on it.
AG
Me too Floridagal! You gave me hope yesterday. Still not comletely cynical. I just am not ready to bury my head in the sand. I start boots on the ground work next week for Francine Busby here in the 50th of CA. SHe will clean up the mess Cunningham made of the district. Read about her here http://www.francinebusby2004.org/
I was po’d at her and sent an email telling her she was ignoring the grassroots and she actually called me hesrself. We talked for half an hour at least. How often does that happen these days! Feet to the pavement!!!
Cool!
Does a recommend have to mean agreement with a diary content? I’ve used it at times especially for ones that I might disagree with the perspective but feel the discussion is important.
So have I.
AG
Yeah, I thought the ratings system was like that too. In ratings, I don’t give anything if it can’t be a 4 but in general I thought it the rating was meant to show value of input rather than agreement.
I often consider an opposing opinion more valuable to productive discussion than a series of agreements can be.