Author and Linguist Deborah Tannen recently released a book titled, “You’re Wearing That? Understanding Mothers and Daughters In Conversation.” In an interview with journalist, Terrence McNally, Ms. Tannen was asked of the unique relationship between mothers and daughters; the author responded as one might expect. Tannen spoke of what most consider conventional patterns of communication between the two. As I read, I realized, I could not relate.
Year ago I was an avid reader of Ms. Tannen’s work; I inhaled her every word. I still think her research is infinitely valid and valuable; however, only for a select few. The few may be the majority; they are just not I. I suspect my own sisters might connect to the conclusions Linguist Tannen offers on the subject of mother daughter interactions. Still, I do not.
Much of my life experience differs greatly. Perhaps, my experience is not contrary, it may merely be my perception, and understanding of these that conflicts with what is thought customary.
Tannen suggests that “Mothers see their job as being helpful, taking care of us, being protective, but anything you do in that vein always implies criticism. If you weren’t doing something wrong, you wouldn’t need that advice, help or protection.” This theory clashes with everything my Mom ever said of her approach and philosophy to parenting. It varies with all that she practiced. That is, if you are asking me and not my siblings.
When I was five years old, a new neighbor, Cheryl moved in. She had one of these mothers. I would go to her house and observe the interactions between my now friend and her mother. It was like watching television. I thought; I want a mother like this. I even told my Mom about Mrs. Sheldon and how wonderful she was. Mrs. Sheldon was the exact the opposite of my Mom. I wondered aloud, why was this.
Mrs. Sheldon cooked and cleaned for her husband and children. The other family members needed to do nothing. In the Sheldon family the mother picked out the clothes the family would wear. She combed Cheryl’s hair, her son Allen’s too. She bought and served Wonder<sup>TM</sup> bread. Oh, how I hungered for that. At my house, it was brand X or even worse homemade breads.
Cheryl’s Mom was always looking in on Cheryl and Allen. They did not have much alone time. In my house, private time was often on the menu. I spent much time playing, reading, rearranging furniture, and drawing on my own. Opportunities to contemplate the world were ample. In those early years, I thought, this “too much.” I wanted a mom as attentive as Cheryl’s, or so I believed until I was eight.
At the age of eight, while over at Cheryl’s house I realized Mrs. Sheldon was telling Cheryl what to think, say, do, feel, and who to be most of the time. My Mom never did that. Berenice was always consistent; she practiced, as she believed. Unlike Mrs. Sheldon, or the mother Dr. Deborah Tannen describes, my mother offered very little, if any, visible signs of protection.
Invisible criticisms were nonexistent in my mind. Advice was scarce, so scarce I recall none addressing a specific incident or decision. I would seek it and always receive the same response. “Do what ever makes you happy as long as it does not hurt anyone.” If I bothered to probe, further I would hear these words, a philosophy my Mom lived by “No one has the right to tell you what you should think, say, do, feel, or be.” Thus, she never did.
My Mom shared her opinions openly on religion, sex, politics, and all the subjects others think taboo. She never told me that I needed to believe as she does. Actually, she encouraged my exploring for myself. If I disagreed with her views, I felt very safe saying so. We would discuss our differences eternally. Dialogue was promoted. Barbara Ruth believed “Question everything,” even authority, whatever that is. She offered infinite opportunities to do so.
Long before my birth, a magazine rack was placed near the toilet in every bathroom. Many members of my family spent a good amount of time on the bowl. Within these stands were biology books written for a very young audience. There were also natural science texts for the adults. In each, the topic of reproduction was covered. Periodically, my Mom would casually “quiz” me on my understanding of these materials. By the age of five, she felt I was fluent. Finally, those talks ended.
At six, while at school or camp I would hear my peers telling “dirty jokes.” I thought these are so silly. These people are totally uniformed. In my home, there were three hardbound “dirty joke” manuscripts, also in the lavatory. These were funnier than any playground puns. These volumes often played with the visual. Drawings of how a short man’s body fit so tightly into the profile of a taller busty woman’s were a vivid treat for me.
My Mother never worried of my appearance. She trusted I knew what was best for me. Berenice Barbara always believed you raise your children to be autonomous. That was her intent and her custom. By an early age, I had learned to iron. I cannot remember a time in early childhood when she would not explain how to determine the quality of a fabric, whether we were buying towels or clothing. She would think aloud and I would learn why she preferred one purchase or another.
My Mom never told me what to buy or wear. She let me experiment. As a teen, another close friend, Dawn, was given a dollar amount to spend on her fall wardrobe. Though it seemed she was free to shop, she was not. Every purchase had to be approved by her parents. I could not imagine such a restriction.
The interesting thing is I was never wild, rebellious, or resentful. I had no reason for dissent. I think because we spoke of everything, because I had the freedom to error, I felt no compulsion to do so.
My parents politics were quite radical, our life style never was. It was very conservative. There were principles. These were made known, though not presented as limitations. The rational was offered, conversations were continual, and life was consistent. What was said would be done. If there was reason to vary, that too was discussed. I think this gave me a sense of security, self, and a feeling of conviction that could not be compared.
In my middle schools years, I was purposely exposed to a world where sex, drugs, and violence were easily accessible. Though I hung-out with the “cool kids,” when they engaged in these follies, I chose to leave. None of these seemed interesting to me. I always felt that my Mom knew she could be sure of my decisions and me. In truth, for decades, she trusted me when I did not trust myself!
Now if you ask at least one of my sisters of her relationship with our mother, you will hear a different tale, the specifics may or may not match. Nevertheless, the reverence will be lost. A few years ago, this sibling mentioned her feelings about our mother. She said, “I never liked Mommy.” She inquired, did I? I quietly laughed to myself. I thought she knew; actually, I always imagined this was among the reasons she and I were not closer. “I like and love Mommy.” Were she not my mother I would absolutely choose to know her; she is infinitely interesting to me.
I also think people change constantly. My Mom had me at a much later age. She had evolved as a person and made conscious decisions about her parenting preferences. Who my Mom is to me is not who she was to my siblings. She grew.
My sisters are their own beings. Their history, background, and experiences are unique to them, as is their analysis of such. I think this true for all of us.
As I assess the extreme differences of opinion between my sister and myself, I observe as my Mom often espoused, “You get what you expect.” I think more often then not, it is not our gender that guides our encounters, nor is it our title, mother, daughter, father, or son. It is what we experience individually; it is how we internalize the events of our lives. The unique emotions evoked during an exchange have more power than any given encounter. We can label these, generalize these, look for those that validate our beliefs, still, we create the space that a person, place or entity occupies in our mind.
In the “Art of Loving” by Erich Fromm, I recall reading descriptions of mothers and fathers. Fromm spoke of mothers as the nurturing parent, the person that offered unconditional love, or at least that was my interpretation of his words. Perhaps, I read, as I believe, because it more closely parallels my own experience. Erich Fromm was among my Mom’s favorites. This too many have influenced my understanding.
I treasure my Mom. A close friend of ours once observed he knew many mothers and their daughters, though some were friends, there always seemed a hidden sense of obligation. He noted, with my Mom and I it was clear, we just like each other.
I wish to share this, the first paragraph in a letter I wrote to Berenice, my Mom years ago; I wanted her to know how special she was and is to me. I thank you Deborah Tannen for giving me reason to reflect. Ms. Tannen, I read of how much your Mother meant much to you, in that we are the same. Only our relationships differed.
I love you Mommy . . .
This letter may have been written, attempted, and mailed many times in the past, but there is still so much I want you to know about my great thanks for you being you and allowing me to be me. There is so much I want to learn from you. I want to hear your stories. I want to see life from your view! I never seem to get enough of all that you are, all that you offer, all that you say, and all that you do! I miss you even when I am with you because thanks to you, my appetite for learning is unlimited! There is so much in your mind, in your actions, in your life, your thoughts, your feelings, that I miss the nuances; once is never enough. Others laugh and understand the unique quality of our exchanges . . . Mom, I do too.
Relating To References . . .
- Deborah Tannen
- “You’re Wearing That? Understanding Mothers and Daughters In Conversation.” By Deborah Tannen
- The Struggle Between Mothers and Daughters, By Terrence McNally, AlterNet. June 29, 2006
- Deborah Tannen References
- Real Boys: Rescuing Our Sons from the Myths of Boyhood, By William Pollack, Ph.D. Henry Holt and Company
- Genderlect Styles of Deborah Tannen April 7, 1999
- Erich Fromm, By C. George Boeree. Personality Theories
Betsy L. Angert Be-Think
Please share your experiences. Does your mother/daughter relationship, or father/son relationship parallel those that society accepts as true?
For the men reading this treatise, you may be interested in the book “Real Boys,” by Dr. William Pollack. He speaks of what I too experience. Men are extremely sensitive, loving, and nurturing. Society trains them not to show this; however, it is infinitely evident, from the time they are in the womb, and just after birth, they crave connections and feel these so very deeply.
I thank you are for reading, reflecting, and sharing.
My own mother died when I was seven. She was a very strong trail blazing sort of woman who oddly loved children and had four of us and another on the way the day she died. From the short time I had with her though I was well on my way to being my own person, just as she was. I connected with her on a special level because we were both the oldest child. After her loss my father and various older family members raised me, educated me, guided me and I was always allowed to be me. In junior high I experienced my first jealousy of friends who had doting mothers. In high school I experienced a disconnect from the girls who had doting mothers and a kind of resentment and dislike from the doting moms themselves. I didn’t realize then that how I carried myself and the things I permitted myself to master could cause their own daughters to question all that “doting”. I was kind of confused about it all until around the age of 23. It was then that I realized that doting mothers of their daughters are very often simply smothering their daughters selfhood and seemed to feed on it in some weird way. In my early twenties many of my girlfriends appeared to have severe self esteem issues, would call me to help them read the directions and put together their barstools……my God, I couldn’t believe how little they believed in themselves. They gave me plenty of kudos for any “help” I ever gave them and that seemed to put a balm on some of the confusing signals I received growing up. What a price to pay though. After school I just seemed to hit the ground running in a very disparaging way by comparison. I have raised my daughter in the way that made sense to me…..but it hasn’t always been smooth sailing. She has expressed the desire to have a “doting” mother also when she was younger. I explained to her why I wasn’t that sort of mother and she seemed to be able to move on with it after hearing my take on my role. She has had lots of private time and seems to require it now along with a very active social life. Her private time is when she contemplates and works out the conflicts and intricacies and of her own life. Last year she went through a phase of venomously disliking me and wanting to step on my face…….I didn’t understand that because I never got to go through that with my mom. That phase is gone now and she even phoned me not long ago when she went through a breakup with her boyfriend and was sad and down hearted. I am her mother and I will always hold her close to my heart and soul and have a warm sheltering embrace when she has to endure life’s trials! I adored her so much as a smaller child running around shedding her own brand of “light” on everything. It would seem that until death do us part she always will. As far as being protective goes, just show up and attempt to do harm to my child and you’ll find out just how protective I am. I was tested once and I scared the shit out of myself coming face to face with that part of myself. A strong woman who esteems herself will dispatch people to Jesus with ease if they attempt to hurt her children and she won’t even blink a damned eye!
Dear Militarytracy . . .
I appreciate your comment more than you might imagine.
I was beginning to wonder whether my writing was wise. Sharing how special my Mom is and the specific reasons why I believe this may remind others of what they rather not reflect upon. It seems some do not become closer to their moms until later in their lives. For others, it may not be forth coming any time soon.
I am thankful that you too had the time and space to consider what was and why.
I too was late in realizing this.
This is beautiful!
I am thankful that you and your daughter can and do share and will enjoy eternally!
I sincerely thank you for the gratitude you express for this writing.
It is a deep deep subject. It is one of those diaries that a person may have to mull over a bit. The only reason why I didn’t require much mulling is because the loss of my mother at the age that did has required me to define my motherhood and how I relate to my own daughter on such a conscious level. It’s kind of right on the surface for me.
Dear Militarytracy . . .
I appreciate this assessment. Perhaps you are correct. The subject is not a superficial one and for many may require great reflection.
I think you feel as I do; even since her passing, my Mom continually gives me much!
Of this, “Your writing is very wise!” ahhhhhhh. I thank you!
I had a completely different experience with my mother – but came up with the same result for myself I think.
My mom was the doting kind – but only in her attempts to cook and clean for us all. She never gave any emotional support. And I cooperated with that. There was something in me from the beginning that held a distance from both my parents. Given that they are miserable with their own lives, but can’t see or do anything about that – I think my distance was some sort of innate wisdom.
So, the end result was that I had to learn how to think and feel for myself. It took me until almost 30 to do that – with lots of help from friends and mentors. But I got there nonetheless.
Dear NLinStPaul . . .
I recognize your story. It is similar to the majority I hear. So many of my friends had the appearance of love; yet distance was the truth they experienced.
My Mom always said, “You do not have to like them just because they are blood relatives.” I trust you understand, like is quite different than love.
Her own mother was . . . let me just say, there relationship was not a pleasant experience. Mentors and friends helped her to mend. Actually, I suspect this is true for all of us.
I too had much to heal. There is so much that is confusing. Emotions are powerful, more so than the rational mind.
I thank you for sharing your thoughts and story. I think we all can see other selves in aspects of another.
My mother was both my liberator and oppressor and I was her fond dream and her nightmare. She herself was so conflicted about the harsh gender standards of the time and their disconnect with reality that she was often unhappy or confused. And whether she intended to or not, she raised up a gender rebel. I’ve nearly always questioned assumptions, including my own, and my life has been all the richer for it. Mama was a talented person whose skills weren’t honored by society; mine are, even when I’ve had to be up in someone’s face to get the recognition. I will not be stopped by someone else’s ideas of “how girls are”. Thanks Mama, I sure miss you.
Dear homemadesoup . . .
Wow! The story behind this sharing intrigues me. I am thankful that she was able to give you the strength to receive what she did not. In many aspects, I think the same is true for my Mom and me.
I hope that you are still able to share your thanks with her in person. If not, my desire is that you experience her presence as I do of my Mom, daily.
I always felt no matter how I tried to tell her how much she means to me, she never knew. The depth cannot be explained.
Some of this discussion sounds like my book group last month. We are a collection of women in our 50’s. We just read “The Feminine Mystique” – most of us for the first time. Our discussion focused on how the mystique affected our mothers. I think it brought out a sense of empathy for our mothers where we had previously focused on our negative judgement of them.
Dear NLinStPaul . . .
I still have yet to read it, though I want to. I think the introduction of such was, in part, responsible for my Mom leaving her marriage . . . after more than twenty years.
She married my natural father to get out of her house and lose her virginity. The sex was great and kept her there long after she knew she was really gone. She went into therapy, went to school, and left behind much of what was her acceptable life. She created anew. I will have to read the book.
I thank you for this dialogue. It is so fun for me!
I read this early today and have been thinking about what to write ever since.
My relationship with my mother today is very cordial and polite but lacking in any real emotional depth. She was the mother of seven girls who never seemed to enjoy girls. She said often that girls are too hard to raise because they’re complicated and mean and she would rather have eight boys than just the one. Consequently I grew up hating my girlness and feeling like a burden to her.
Her life was hard as the wife of an alcoholic. The burden of feeding and housing eight children fell upon her as did the disciplining and making all major decisions. She was the authoritarian. She was the one who smacked you in the face if you gave her any backtalk. There were no hugs to be had, no reading of bedtime stories, no brushing of hair, no tickling and cuddling. She fixed meals and held tight control of the food in the house because she needed to ration it. Today I have a complicated relationship with food. It seems a much deeper relationship than the one I have with my mother.
She was not a doting mother. She was uninvolved emotionally. We could not go to her with our problems. It was never stated, at least directly, but it was clear that she was barely handling that which life had forced on her and it would be selfish to burden her with any extra ‘frills.’
We all did our own laundry and other chores from a very early age or it didn’t get done.
I spent my childhood coveting the mothers of my friends; the warm and involved women who decorated their daughter’s room and knew the names of her friends and helped her pick out clothes from the store.
As an adult I envied women who were close to their mothers. I still do. Many many times I have attempted to create that closeness but my attempts are short lived and fall with a great thump of reality very early on.
I can’t say with any certainty that I love my mother. I know I will miss her when she’s gone but at least I can stop trying to build a fire out of ice.
I would add that I admire my mother and the incredible way she was able to keep us all fed and dressed in clean clothes. Her focus was so complete in meeting those basic everyday needs that there was never any room for warmth. I understand that and marvel at how she coped.
for sharing so much. I also had to deal with food issues, mine was anorexia so I HAD TO DEAL with it earlier in life. It was part of a lot of self discovery that I made in my very early twenties. Because my mothers death was so sudden and included all of my siblings and also because my father was a head injury survivor who dealt with his feelings of inadequacy with alcohol, I was left with an underlying feeling that sometimes everything was wildly out of my control. So I chose this one item that was necessary to life and I proved to myself and everybody else that I could fucking control something damn it…..I almost controlled right over the cliff though. Because the root of my “food issues” was addressed though I have gratefully not relapsed. It was an odd thing that I went through taking my focus off of the food for a minute and refocusing on everything in my young adult life that I had say over and that was working exactly the way it is meant to all work. I had a lot of grieving that I had to do also, but I wouldn’t have missed a minute of it. In the end, there I was waiting to fully embrace Me.
And you know (or maybe you don’t)what a remarkable woman I think you have turned out to be in spite of all the losses you suffered so early on.
I agree! and also extend my thanks for your being you!
Dear Militarytracy . . .
I love you!!! That was so well stated!
I did anorexia and bulimia. The first too difficult; neither provided a sense of control. They both were the source of increased chaos. My habit had nothing to do with food or weight. Ah, those not so lovely emotions and how we internalize what occurs in our lives.
My Mom felt my relationship with food was her fault. That is so sad to me. It had nothing to do with her. My feelings were hindering my health.
I offer the treatise that I front-paged for a broader audience. My earlier writings on my eating habits are at my own site, as is this one. However, presenting this piece to a known and broader public was my full coming out party.
WEIGHT. BALANCING FAT WITH FEELINGS, HABITS WITH HEALTH ©
SecondNature, Militarytracy and I think you are great!!!! By the way, my natural father wanted only boys. Each time my Mom was pregnant, she thought to herself, “Girl, girl, girl.” She believes in mind over matter. There are three of us, all girls!
We all marvel at you and her.
Dear Second Nature . . .
This is when I disdain technology; it is not as fluid as a genuine conversation. Your writing brings so much to mind, I wish we could meld for I fear I will not be able to write it all.
I have learned that when people life a life full of chaos they try to appear and stay in control. That is no way a reflection of their feelings. What any of us think, say, do, feel, or are, is about us!! Our hurts and fears tend to guide us more than our joys. It is the sadness of the human condition. If you read Daniel Goleman’s Emotional Intelligence and learn of the structure of the brain and how this affect us, this may resonate for you as it did for me.
Of your relationship with food, I lived that for more than two decades. I have written of it often. Only two or three months ago, I not only front-paged it on my own site Be-Think I was able to front page it at My Left Wing. I also post it at Daily Kos and I believe here at Booman.
In my family food was the celebration of life and family; however, when I turned to it, it was not a celebration. Working through that was a trial and tribulation I cannot begin to express. I never thought I would able to stop that cycle!
Life with an alcohol, particularly at a young age can do so much damage. The woman that was hired to take care of me and was my surrogate Mom for the first five and one-half years was an alcoholic. I did not know this until I overheard her firing. I was on the telephone extension in another room. Actually, this woman introduced me to the Sheldon’s. I often wonder; did she desire her alone time for drinking.
Fortunately, my exposure to the life of living with an alcoholic or awareness for what was going on was slight. I have very close friends that have shared more. They too, the alcoholic and the caretakers are marinating in their pain; it pours out and spills onto all those that encounter them.
Please know the hurtful words said to you, the distance you experienced had nothing to do with you. We all, even parents have a life full of experiences we need to work through.
I am so grateful that you felt safe in sharing this. Please feel free to read any of my more personal pieces; comment, I will respond.
Dear Second Nature, I suspect that what is true for you is also true for others. I front-paged this essay at My Left Wing this morning. I received no comments. I wonder if it is as was stated here by Militarytracy. This topic brings up much for many.
SecondNature, I will never be able to truly share how impressed I am that you had the courage to share!!!
I saw a review of this book on AlterNet and I found it really interesting. I have a mother and am a mother (of a 12 year old, going on 16). My strongest memories of my mom are from when I was 12-13.
My mom was a nightmare. She did not coddle, she did not listen, she was basically completely not there for us in any way, shape or form. She was cruel and an alcoholic, and yet, we always knew that she loved us in her own way.
My parents believed that letting us do whatever we wanted was the right thing, at least by the time I came around (I have three older brothers). But, my mom offered no emotional support at all. My dad tried, but he had his limits, and he was a guy, so not one I could talk to about female stuff. So what should have been an open and liberal household became a neglectful household with few rules and even less enforcement. On the plus side, I did learn from my mistakes and I am glad I had the freedom to make those mistakes.
What this experience taught me was that there is a middle ground. It is important to let your kids explore, but it is equally important to set boundaries for safe exploration.
What I most missed in my family was having someone I could really talk to about my worries, my joy, my fears, and my desires. So, I made it clear early on that my daughter could express all that and more and I made a promise to myself not to judge her. So, instead of saying “You’re wearing that!?”, I will talk with her about what messages she sends by wearing certain clothes and let her choose after she has heard both the good and the bad. If something looks good on her, I tell her so, and why. If something looks bad, I do the same. But in the end, it is her choice what to wear.
She is very melodramic, like most kids her age. If she needs to talk, I always drop what I am doing and listen. If I can give advice, I do, but I emphasize that these are the kinds of things she will need to work out on her own. She recently discovered that exagerating is an awful lot like lying and did little to gain friends. Rather than punish her for lying, we talked about how her behavior impacted her friendships and why she felt the need to make stuff up. I think she learned a great lesson and punishment would have only made her feel worse about herself.
There is no such thing as a perfect parent. The majority of us just try to do what we feel is right and we all have inner demons to fight along the way.
My mom to this day is hypercritical, while I responded by being so positive that my kid sometimes thinks she can never live up to my expectations no matter how many times I tell her that it is her expectations that matter and not mine.
So far, so good. She is a great kid and we have a great relationship. I just hope I am as strong as MT when my kid goes through the “You suck” phase. :>)
Dear Kamakhya . . .
I thank you soooo very much for this sharing. I think we are all learning from others here.
I think this is beautiful!
Of the rules and enforcement, I think there is a need for standards. These in my mind must be based on principles, a shared philosophy of values and beliefs. Consistency is vital; without it, how can there ever be reciprocal reverence. I understand how too much freedom and too little enforcement can feel as though no one cares. I saw this in a classmate’s home.
wow! I can relate. I often fear[ed] living up to what were the expectations I placed on myself, though feared others would.
Parenthood is quite a precarious position. Phew!! You are doing very well, even if your examples were not as you desired, at least they inspired great thought and action.
Again, I am grateful for your words and thoughts!
My mother was a hostile mom. She told me that a few years ago. That explained so much to me about my childhood. She had 8 kids and always worked full time outside the home. I was the oldest daughter so I was the ‘other’ mom to my siblings. My mother was never approachable for personal conversations when we were young, but she always found time to cook, can veggies, give us birthday parties and great Christmases, great vacations etc. My dad was/is the most stable man I’ve ever known. During Lent we would all kneel in the living room and say the rosary all month long-with eight kids it often became a shouting match-very funny now looking back. She and dad volunteered a lot and were busy in the community also. So although there was little one on one in my family we were a stable and fun active family. My mom was good with money and she is the reason my parents have a good retirement now. (We thought, as kids, that we were on the poor side of life..but we weren’t.)
Now that all her children have their own lives and families she has time for lots of one on ones and is the person we can turn to for a shoulder. She is generous with her time and money. My mom was worth waiting for to get to know. And I am grateful that my whole huge family is still very alive and intact.
What I do know is that it takes two people to communicate. I always asked my mom personal questions..it just took a lot of years before she literally had the time to talk and answer me.
Dear roseeriter . . .
I thank you for thinking the topic is worthy of discussion and I am grateful you chose to add to it!
Wow! How strong and loving of your Mom to come and speak with you of where she was when you were younger. It is evident that she loves and trusts you, then and now.
Evolution is such a glorious thing. We all have so much to learn, to give, and to re-evaluate.