The liberal blogosphere went to war to defend the CIA when the Bush administration disclosed that Valerie Wilson (nee Plame) was employed there. I hope in the process of covering Plamegate that I conveyed some of the complexity of the agency. It’s true that the CIA carried out the worst offenses of the Bush administration when they set up their detainee programs. It’s also true that they repeatedly lied to Congress and enabled the Bush administration’s march to war (it’s a slam dunk case). But…they also leaked that they really didn’t believe there were WMD and they leaked about the secret prisons in Eastern Europe, and they leaked about the torture. The CIA serves the president. But major elements within the Agency didn’t like Bush and sought to undermine his reelection. That is why Porter Goss was brought in in 2005.
Nevertheless, now that Pelosi has declared open warfare on the CIA, she has no choice but to go all the way. She says the Agency misled Congress. Now she has to prove it. When the dust settles, we may no longer have a CIA. At least, like the KGB, we may have to change the name. Any attempt at half measures now will see Pelosi crushed like a bug. In for a dime, in for a dollar.
I’m with you on this. I bet the decent CIA employees have been in a difficult position for a long time. It would be good to start all over and change the National Security Act of 1947. It has caused so many problems and cost a fortune.
I know a lot of paranoid idiots would be screaming. Look at what Robt. Gate has been trying to repair at Defense. It has gotten out of hand.
The CIA built a new building in the 1990’s and congress didn’t even know about it.
Pelosi has taken a stand. She won’t back down. She has the power to start the process of preventing the same type of abuses from happening in the future.
This has to be done slowly. Bush left such an unholy mess that Obama has to concern himself with the people of this country surviving the financial ruin we are in.
Oh, and Afganistan etc.
It’s a Win-Win situation.
And then we would get Hoyer….
Plenty of abuse still going on too-
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/05/15-9
Obama needs to clean the CIA of all the Bush appointees turned civil servants who have wormed their way into the CIA. None if this would be necessary if the AG Holder file for a special prosecutor to investigate the war crimes of Dick Cheney, John Yoo, and Condi Rice.
Exactly. These people have admitted to committing crimes! And daring people to hold them accountable!
But didn’t the special prosecutor law lapse? Wouldn’t a congressional act be required? Or, I guess Holder could just appoint someone within the Dept. to be “independent” to give him political cover–in essence pass the buck and let an individual prosecutor make the decision for the AG. Or they could go to a grand jury to also give them political cover.
Jeez. I can’t believe Holder and the Dems, that now control Washington and won in a landslide, are afraid of Mr. 18% Dead-Ender-Torturer-War Criminal.
The Democrats truly are cowards. Or complicit. And probably a bit of both.
And the best way to clean the agency of the filth appointed by Bush-Cheney would be to terminate the agency and start afresh. Let them reapply for their old jobs. Isn’t that the way it’s done in the so much more perfect private sector?
You might ask John Negroponte how easy it is to move CIA off to the side.
Imagine having the CIA chief (Goss) shielding a bunch of embezzlers (Foggo & Co) while a new superboss (Negroponte) is installed above it all in the food chain. If that didn’t squash CIA, what will?
Imagine a new DCI (Hayden) anointed, after having been stuck long past his stipulated time as DIRNSA, plus having his crown jewels (TRAILBLAZER) there go down in flames to the tune of $10 billion. If that doesn’t get people’s attention, what will?
Negroponte has been mentioned in association with many nefarious CIA activities. Among them would be the Contras in Nicaragua, revolution in Haiti, the coup against Chavez in Venezuela, and brutal repression in El Salvador. Goss probably didn’t do anything that Negroponte didn’t agree with.
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(Oct. 30, 2007) – McConnell belongs to that school of thought by which democracy thrives through ignorance. Although little noted, he took another step to save the public from the burden of having too much information about its government’s activities:
“NIE summaries will not be published if doing so would complicate U.S. policy interests “by revealing negative assessments of leaders or countries whose cooperation is essential for the attainment of policy objectives, or otherwise affect military, diplomatic or spy operations.”
After 2009, we probably will find that the annual budget becomes a state secret again. A House-Senate conference on H.R. 1 introduced a “compromise” provision that permits the President to refuse to disclose intelligence budget figures beginning in 2009 merely by submitting a statement declaring that disclosure could harm national security.
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."Propaganda costs money.
It’s always frustrated me that Nancy Pelosi was portrayed as a Far Leftist even though I consider her positions to be pretty middle-of-the-road. In the last election I almost voted for a more liberal candidate.
But if she stands her ground on this issue I will support her. Hopefully she understands that she is the person that is best able to push the Democratic party, the Congress, and the country back from the brink of despotism. She needs to show that she’s a principled patriot when called to duty and not back down to the thugs. If our silly media picks Cheney to represent one side and her on the other, and she’s willing to fight as hard as Cheney is, then I will support her as the spokeswoman for the anti-torture side. It’s the best I can hope for.
I’m pleased she gets it so far and is fighting on this issue (even if the primary reason is because she’s being personally attacked). And even if she is culpable for not acting quickly enough I am willing to forgive if she repents and fights hard now. I’m a pragmatist and while I think someone that was against torture from the beginning, like Dennis Kucinich, should lead the party (not only on this issue but in general), I’m willing to compromise by supporting compromised leaders, like Pelosi, as long as she fights for reals now. There are so few people in power making the argument that this is evidently the best we can hope for.
Also, you should include the Iran NIE on your list of leaks the C.I.A. has engaged in. That’s the big one in my mind. Both Obama and Bush are portraying Iran as the Evil Empire that needs to be attacked (with a PR assist from Israel) and the C.I.A. is the only establisment source that called the conventional wisdom into question. So obviously we’re not talking about the whole C.I.A. here–there is something going on there and thus far the dark forces of Cheney et al. have been winning but with some notable exceptions–as you show.
Actually. I’ve changed my mind. Let’s have a special prosecutor look into Pelosi’s briefing and see if she broke any laws or if the Agency broke any laws.
Let’s call their bluff. Who cares about Pelosi. This is a criminal inquiry into the matter and I don’t care if it starts with Pelosi because if it’s truly an independent prosecutor there will be other targets besides Pelosi. Maybe the prosecutor will want to look into the destruction of videotapes. Maybe crimes of torture themselves.
If the Republicans want to sign up for an independent prosecutor because Pelosi may be involved then let’s sign them up before they realize what that really means.
What’s unfortunate is that Obama will have to deal with the CIA so soon. It was inevitable, but he’ll have to take sides now, before he’s had a chance to fix healthcare or anything else. The timing really sucks, which is maybe part of the point.
Re Pelosi – if it’s a fight between her and the CIA, she’s already lost. She says the CIA has misled Congress? As of when? How long has she known that, and kept quiet? (Hell, I knew that before Pelosi was ever speaker.)
That’s why it’s so hard to take on the CIA. Any of your own flaws will be pulled out and displayed to the masses long before the CIA airs its secrets.
That said, I hope this leads more to a Church Committee outcome, not a Pike Committee outcome. The CIA vowed to crush Congressman Pike when he took on investigating the CIA. I expect they’ll react no differently to Pelosi.
I’m all for a solid investigation of the intelligence agencies. But let’s not pretend Pelosi is going to come out of this smelling like a rose. Far from it.
Did you know that Pike’s son is running to be my congressman?
Wow, cool. Is his father still alive? I wonder..! He could really prep his son well, if he is..!
yeah, as far as I can tell he is living in Vero Beach, Florida. He got remarried in 2002 and like boating. He’s 87 years old.
I’d love to interview him and get an update. Do you know his son? I’d really like to get in touch with his father…
There are competing factions in the Agency, which have only become more pronounced over time.
There ARE liberals, educated people in the Agency, many on the analyst side, who care about the things we care about and want to make the world a better place.
There are Neocons, who believe America has a right to empire and want the CIA to support that.
And then there are the thugs who lie about anything and everything, deal drugs to make cash on the side, etc. Let’s never forget that our tax dollars pay their salaries too.
There are those in the Agency who support Obama, and those who oppose him. But the one thing they’ll all close ranks to support? Their own jobs, and the preservation of the Agency.
The CIA and NSA should have been disbanded decades ago. They’ve been ineffectual and corrupt for most of their existence. We need a thorough housecleaning and restructuring of our intelligence institutions. I think everybody knows this. But taking on such a mission impossible is another story — it would require many knowledgeable people who are willing to sacrifice everything for the good of the nation. And yet as time goes on there will be no other option if we want to preserve this republic.
I don’t see any point in dismantling the CIA because whatever we build next will simply employ all the same people and tactics. I’d rather find a way to make the CIA much more transparent. Will there always be a need for secret operations? I don’t know. Probably. But should they be of the size and scale and with the same lack of accountability as they are now? I think not!
Not necessarily ALL the same people. There comes a time when institutions are so inbred and corrupt that reform is no longer possible. Only a clean sweep has a chance to clear out the accumulated networks, assumptions, and institutional memory. You’d like to find a way to make the CIA more transparent, as would we all. But you can’t. The only way to bring it (and the rest of the security establishment) under control is to dump it and start over.
it’s the same reason we should close Gitmo even though we could just keep it and stop abusing people. Image and symbolism.
Well, that’s a good point.
This is the torture timeline:
http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/timeline-collection/torture-tape-timeline/
note that:
December 18, 2001: Ibn Sheikh al-Libi captured. After being tortured, al-Libi made up stories about Al Qaeda ties to Iraq.
This is the smoking gun, actually two- for it proves that torture was happening before congress was notified and the purpose of torture was to connect 9/11 to Iraq..
Note:
September 4, 2002: Porter Goss and Nancy Pelosi briefed on OLC memos, not told Abu Zubaydah had already been tortured.
But
July 26, 2002: Bybee tells CIA waterboarding is legal. CIA begins to waterboard Abu Zubaydah.. who was waterboarded over 83 times in one month. Now what is the purpose of torturing a person so often?
And now, today:
http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/15/graham-they-claimed-to-have-briefed-before-torture-did-
not/
“I’ve got to correct something I said yesterday about Bob Graham. I reported that Graham said that CIA had given him two erroneous dates for briefings. That was wrong (RawStory reported the number correctly, though). They gave erroneous dates for three briefings.
The difference is critical, because it means the CIA tried to claim it had briefed Graham on torture in April 2002, which would have put it in compliance with the National Security Act. But Graham, by consulting his trusty notebooks, proved that claim to be false. “
Graham has proven that the CIA gave three wrong dates for the briefings. He proved that from his notes, and the CIA admitted they erred. So who is to say, now, if they are telling the truth about the dates and contents of the Pelosi briefings?
Marcy needs to distinguish between torture that is done by the Egyptians and torture done by us. Her timeline conflates the two which is important for the Pelosi question.
Well, if the Egyptians were doing our torture for us, is that any different than doing it ourselves?
Not in one sense. But Pelosi didn’t have any right to know what Egypt was doing. She is supposed to be informed of US covert actions requiring a presidential order. Setting up black site prisons? Yes. Ordering an extraordinary rendition? Yes. Being told what Egypt is doing with a detainee? No.
She couldn’t guess there was a reason behind ‘extraordinary rendition’? Please. She’s cowardly, not stupid.
actually, that’s probably not fair. Given our lack of truly qualified translator/interrogators we have relied on Egyptian and Jordanian services for ordinary renditions for a long time. What should have raised alarm bells was suddenly using Syria.
Obama will stand by and allow the CIA to crush Pelosi. She does not stand a chance against the CIA unless she has the backing of congress and the media, which she does not have because the media is republican and authoritarian to its core.
Has nobody been paying attention to the last 4 months? It is quite obvious that the banks and the intelligence community (there is a real misnomer.. intelligence!) run this country. The POTUS is just a figure head that does what he is told.
Next up…. Isreal bombs Iran, and the US approves …. after the fact!
nalbar
Yep. I’ve been wondering how long it would take Obama to figure that out. Not long, evidently, as shown by his sudden backtracks of late.
Obama warns Netanyahu: Don’t surprise me with Iran strike
U.S. President Barack Obama has sent a message to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu demanding that Israel not surprise the U.S. with an Israeli military operation against Iran. The message was conveyed by a senior American official who met in Israel with Netanyahu, ministers and other senior officials. Earlier, Netanyahu’s envoy visited Washington and met with National Security Adviser James Jones and with Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, and discussed the dialogue Obama has initiated with Tehran.
The message from the American envoy to the prime minister reveals U.S. concern that Israel could lose patience and act against Iran. It is important to the Americans that they not be caught off guard and find themselves facing facts on the ground at the last minute.
Obama did not wait for his White House meeting with Netanyahu, scheduled for next Monday, to deliver his message, but rather sent it ahead of time with his envoy.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/s…
Destroy it. Since the wars began, I’ve been really uncomfortable with the way the left — quite cynically, I think — decided to forget the bulk of the 20th century and start cheerleading for the CIA and, for that matter, the FBI, for no better reason that to dodge bullshit claims of unpatriotic behavior from the right, as if there is anything the left could do to silence those idiots.
And yes, I understand we need intelligence and law enforcement agencies, however much they tend to grossly overestimate their utility. But the CIA and the FBI have been so tainted by mind-bogglingly criminal activity over the years that the house needs to be thoroughly cleaned, if not actually razed to the ground. Sometimes corruption is so pervasive and systemic that one cannot reform, one must replace. We don’t need a cleaner, more ethical CIA — we need a new agency altogether.
And I also understand that there are decent folks in both agencies. It would be nice if we could keep those few good apples when we dump the barrel of rotten apples out. That said, we cannot allow the criminal overlords at the CIA and FBI to use their honest subordinates as human shields.
I agree. The left somehow bought the myth that the CIA was “liberal” and therefore worth protecting.
Or, to look at it another way, the CIA took control over the left when they took out both Kennedys, King, and Malcolm X and propped up others in their places.
I just find it ironic that we may see a truth commission out of this because the guys responsible for the crimes can’t keep their traps shut.