Daniel Pipes on the Iranian elections: “I think it about the best result possible.” The emerging meme on the right (when they even deign to discuss this election) is that the Iranian people woke up on Saturday and realized that they had been living in a sham democracy all along. There is some element of the truth to that, although there is no dispute that things have deteriorated. But, I’d ask the Republicans why they didn’t wake up on Saturday and realize that the Iranian people had never accepted dictatorship. Take a look at the pictures from Teheran. Do those young people look much different than young people in this country? With their westernized clothes and cell phones? Are they not all on Facebook and Twitter? Yes, they are Iranian, and yes, they have different sets of beliefs than American youth. But this is not a country of devils. It’s a country led by some bad people who have some very illiberal ideas on pretty much every topic under the sun. This now includes the idea that you can just make up whatever numbers you want in an 80%-turnout election.
Seeing the people that support democracy out in the streets, the American impulse (speaking, at least, for me) is to want to find some way to support them. Unfortunately, sixteen years before I was born Dwight D. Eisenhower took the other side in a battle for democracy in Iran. He thereby destroyed America’s ability to be of assistance now. Even kind and encouraging words would probably be counterproductive. Think about what a shame that is. Imagine if the Poles and Czechs and East Germans and Hungarian democrats had been unwilling to receive even rhetorical support from the United States when the Berlin Wall was coming down?
Iran used to be a great ally to the United States. Unfortunately, we were not a good ally to them. With some luck, we can both do better in the future. Our two countries would have significant differences under any conceivable systems of government, but our two peoples are not so different and can find much common ground. Let us hope the Iranian democrats find a way to prevail without our help, so that we may be of help to each other in the future.
And what is even sadder is that I remember some TV crew(not sure which of the Big Three) interviewing Iranian youth. You know what they said? They basically compared What’s-his-name to Bush. Meaning loud, belligerent, tough talking asshats. The students there wanted to be like students here. With the freedoms we enjoy. And they all say that Bush would have been stupid to bomb Iran(or give okay for Israel to do it). In other words, there is a lot more we have in common than different, if only the politicians would get their heads out of their ass.
All state-run religions eventually become deeply unpopular. That the US banned that in its Constitution helps explain why American is so much more religious than Europe.
I really wish I could read Farsi.
Mousavi’s announcement.
Ed: The Pipes piece says BOTH candidate agree with Mousavi. I have not heart that the ex-Revolutionary Guard Commander who was the other conservative (Rezae I think) also has denounced the results.
Can you see if you can find confirmation on that somewhere? I haven’t been able to and that would be a huge thing.
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I think the counter meme has some merit though. If Amahdi is Bush, then Mousavi is John Kerry and this is the elite (middle-class and above) rioting while the vast majority of the poor did vote for Amahdinejad. What we are seeing are city youth. What do you men and women from the country-side think?
“It appears that the working classes and the rural poor–the people who do not much look or act or talk like us–voted overwhelmingly for the scruffy, scrappy president who looks and acts and talks more or less like them.”
From the Newsweek Dickey piece. I don’t know, I have heard that even in rural areas his support was less because while he has tried to help them to a certain extent, their lives still mostly suck.
After reading as much information as I can, I do think the vote was fixed but I have no idea how much popular support the Mousavi people actually have. I have not a clue. I hope they succeed but non-violence does not work without force to back it up.
Daniel Pipes could only have joy at the reelection of Amaj, as it saves the right wing Likud’s best red herring for avoiding peace negotiations on two states and the Palestinian statehood issue.
Since Hamas, the previous red herring, has been talking two states for some time and seems more accepting of Obama’s peace initiative, Iran has become THE foil with which to stave off Obama. How can Israel even consider peace with Iran now ready to wipe Israel off the map?
Yup. They live to keep stirring up BS. I heard Troy McClure…er, Mitt Romney (phony, blow-dried used car salesmen) be deliberately obtuse during the CSPAN radio rebroadcast of the ABC yak-yak show (and others) today. That’s all they have left.
I actually think he has more sense than he displays which makes me despise him even more. That and this seemingly pathological need he feels to be elected to…something. We don’t need another spoiled brat rich kid with Daddy issues in the presidency ever again.
Daniel Pipes has in the past been very clear about his preference for AhmadiNejad. A spokesman for Netanyahu once said that AhmadiNejad was a great gift to Israel (Netanyahu also said that 9/11 was one of the best things that could happen for Israel – once a self-absorbed scumbag always a self-absorbed scumbag). In fact, some have suggested that AhmadiNejad was Israel’s “horse in the race”, and made an awfully good case for it.
No matter what Iran does, including scuttling their entire nuclear power program, Israel will continue to make them the bogeyman of the day, and continue to be a serious threat to Iran’s security until and unless they find someone better. The Iranian government are not stupid or crazy, and they have seen enough of Israel’s behaviour throughout history to know that it really doesn’t matter what they do, they will not get Israel off their back. A very poor incentive for them to quit nuclear development (not that I think they should) or whatever minor support they might or might not be giving to Hamas or Hezballah, both of which are homegrown groups with specific very local agendas, and would survive very nicely without Iran anyway.
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Thanks, BooMan!
Check out the StopAhmadi twitter feed.
To me the whole Iran turbulence is looking more and more like two different power centers struggling for primacy, with Moussavi and his Godfather Rafsanjani now injecting street turbulence and national strike threats into the equation.
Nor am I the only one who has inklings of this sort.
I can’t find a good reason at this point for any foreigner to take sides in this, though if I were Iranian I would certainly be ideologically closer to Rafsanjani & co. and the Laissez-Faire Chinese model they favor, than to the Imam Ali Socialism championed by Ahmedinajad & co.
But does that mean I would root for, and perhaps side with, a soft coup attempt that looks straight out of the playbook of the Albert Einstein Institution? As long as there is no real indication that the election was stolen, I don’t think so.
your equal-opportunity cynicism is touching.
If you have a hard time choosing between sides in this dispute, you’re really trying hard to be a relativist.
Is this some kind of reverse identification thing? I don’t mind you taking an opposing view to the “western media narrative” but you are clearly ignoring the reports of shenanigans that took place after voting ended.
I suppose as long as “no real indication that the election was stolen” you’re entitled to that view. The authorities will be releasing any evidence of course…
Also, I think this is bigger than Moussavi. After all, he is one of 4 out of a couple of hundred candidates that were approved to run in this race. None of them are radical or opposed to the system.
…I can’t find a good reason at this point for any foreigner to take sides in this…
Does this sound like reverse identification? On the other hand identification, is what has been going on here frantically and rather uncritically.
Nor am I trying to ignore anything. Bigger than Moussavi? Yes: Godfather Rafsanjani. Bigger than Rafsanjani? Now that’s quite possible, but remains very much to be seen.
This is hilarious. Amidst the chaos in Iran, Ahmadinejad has time to challenge Obama to a debate, again.
Who was saying something about not creating matyrs?
I’m not sure if this aggression will stand, man.
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Haven’t seen these videos posted yet of more protests in Tehran, Khordad (Southern Tehran) and Esfahan.
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."