We seem to have lost the iconoclastic instinct in the Western World, which I count as a good thing. If we want to make depictions of God, we damn well do it. He doesn’t have to compete with other gods for attention, so who cares these days? But Muslims still take this taboo seriously, and they extend it even unto the prophet Mohammed. After the creators of South Park depicted Mohammed in a bear-suit they received a death threat. Seems pretty stupid to my Western sensibilities, but I do respect that others have religious beliefs different from mine. And while I am more than willing to condemn death threats, I don’t think making May 20th Draw Mohammed Day is the best way to make the point. So, I won’t be participating. Even if I think it’s stupid to get offended if someone makes an artistic depiction of Mohammed, I have no interest in offending millions of people to make a point to a few extremists.
About The Author

BooMan
Martin Longman a contributing editor at the Washington Monthly. He is also the founder of Booman Tribune and Progress Pond. He has a degree in philosophy from Western Michigan University.
At its origins, Islam was a pretty tolerant religion, permitting Christians and Jews as “people of the Book” to live in peace although paying higher taxes. Those days appear to be gone in wide parts of Islam.
However, we should bear in mind that Islam is more akin to Protestantism than Roman Catholicism in that there is no one spokesman for and arbiter of official Muslim opinion. So, saying Muslims are all pissed off about this is sort of like saying that Protestants are pissed off about something because the pastor of the Church of the Flaming Wind in Mudhole, Tennessee is pissed off. But, if people insist on pushing at the wound, it will make it bigger.
The Ten Commandments say ‘make no image of God.’ Man is made in God’s image. Therefore, a portrayal of any human – Mohammed or not – is a portrayal of God. This is why Islamic art doesn’t do portraiture by and large, and was also the reasoning behind the original Christian Iconoclastic movement in Byzantium.
Yeah I have to constantly remind Islamophobes of this. They’re usually far-right evangelical Christians, which is roughly 25% of America. Man that’s sad as hell.
Anyway, on topic, I definitely will be participating. For one, I don’t think this offends nearly as many people that you speak of, Booman. For two, I hate religion, and will not resist an attempt to bash the hell out of it. For three, this isn’t something like homosexuality, race, or something outside of your control. You choose your religion. It should be up for criticism just as much as your favorite movie or color. Yeah yeah some people base their entire lives around it and it’s thus an extension of them; again, that’s their choice.
So to hell with not wanting to offend so many people even if it offended as many as you think it will. Maybe it will send a message to the moderate and liberal Muslims that they need to take back their religion from the radical extreme fundies. I think that’s one of the biggest problems with the religion in the first place. A lot of them don’t want to admit that there’s a problem in the first place (especially people in Pakistan, at least that’s what my Muslim acquaintances and friends from the region tell me); I even see this among liberals who are not Muslim. They place the blame on the media for portraying Muslims in a bad light, or that America/Russia/the West has invaded their regions and it’s the only reason we see such extremism. I don’t buy it. We’ve done similar things in South America and by and large, we’re not screening people from Chile when they get off of a plane. There is something inherently wrong with a lot of the followers and interpretations of the religion, and it needs to be addressed.
Oh and I didn’t mean to say that we should be screening Muslims at airports. It was just a way for me to convey my point. That’s obviously the stupidest way to deal with terrorism, not to mention it’s an intrusion on people’s rights.
we gave up worrying about worshipping images when we invented the boob-tube.
And I don’t think most Muslims would be concerned about a respectful depiction of the Prophet. Putting him in a bear-suit on South Park doesn’t fit that description.
I guess I missed the law or section of the Constitution that requires us to only create respectful depictions of the Prophet. Are you seriously siding with the outraged extremists on this? Come on man.
No. I am refusing to participate in a campaign to offend Muslims just to stand up to a few extremists. I defend Trey Parker’s right to do whatever he wants.
You are right. Most Muslims would not be offended by a non-Muslim making a respectful depiction of Mohammad of any kind, and that includes the ones who would call out another Muslim for breaking that taboo. The more stern among them might cluck and roll their eyes at the cluelessness of it all, but that would be about all. And even those who WOULD be offended would not do more than, say, demonstrate, picket, or write letters. Very few Muslims hold non-Muslims to the same standards as they hold themselves when it comes to complying with Islamic rules.
Putting him in a bear suit, or worse, depicting him as a demon, or a child molester, or a raving, violent lunatic (all have been done) – now, that’s a different matter. However, in those cases it is only a tiny, tiny minority who react with threats or actual violence. I am really sick of hearing these outliers presented by people who should know better as representative of Islam, or mainstream Muslims (I don’t mean you are doing that – you obviously are not). And I do recall that there were threats of Christian violence in reaction to the Da Vinci Code.
Didn’t CAIR object to the Supreme Court’s respectful statue of Muhammed alongside the founders of other religions?
So what? The Supreme Court made a mistake, and CAIR respectfully pointed out Muslim objections to this sort of thing. That is part of CAIR’s job of promoting understanding of Islam and Muslims. I also respectfully point out when I see mistakes about Arabs, Islam, and Muslims. It is not that I am necessarily offended by them – whether I am offended depends almost 100% on the intent – it is my effort to bring about a better understanding and better relations on both sides.
“Maybe it will send a message to the moderate and liberal Muslims that they need to take back their religion from the radical extreme fundies.“
How about sending a similar message to moderate and liberal Christians and Jews so they’ll know they need to take back their religion?
And by the way, doe you really expect people to get any kind of a positive message when you insult the founder of their religion?
Hey, fundies are a problem in every religion, obviously. However, don’t give me that shit, Hurria. You know damn well that fundamentalists, while a problem in every school of thought even outside of religion, are not as big of a problem in those religions. Islam is by far the worst in today’s era. Stop playing the tu quoque fallacy and admit that there is a problem with your religion and a lot of its followers. I think Jewish fundamentalism is a problem with the settlements in Palestine, I think Christian fundamentalism is a problem with abortion. However, none of that is as widespread as it is in Islam. I’m tired of the excuses, and your response is exactly what I’m talking about in my original post. Islamophobia is a problem, and I think that’s why so many liberals seem so quick to defend. However, again, I’m sick of the excuses.
If your religion has such thin skin that it can’t handle a little bit of mockery, then it underlies a huge problem with it.
I’m tired of religion and the inability for a group to accept mockery and criticism sometimes. I’m tired of people of Jewish descent stealing land and oppressing people on the basis of “my book said so.” I’m tired of far-right Christians defending that because of their own religion’s prophesy and nothing more. I’m tired of Sarah Palin, and my own mother, calling Muslims “evil.”
To put it another way: I’m sick and tired of religion, and if yours can’t handle a bit of mockery and poking fun at it, then it has serious problems.
Except how would I even attempt to “take back” Christianity from people like Pat Robertson when I don’t even identify myself as having anything to do with him or his followers?
“admit that there is a problem with your religion“
I will admit no such thing any more than I will say there is a problem with Judaism and Christianity, which preceded and share the same basis as Islam. The fact that there are people who try to use Islam, or Christianity, or Judaism as an excuse to commit crimes is not a problem with Islam, Christianity, or Judaism, but a problem with a small minority of people who find it convenient to use a distorted notion of those religions as an excuse for their actions.
Jewish “fundamentalism” is a problem with far more than the colonies in Palestine, and if you think that Christian “fundamentalism” is only a problem with abortion, you need to wake up and take a closer look at the Christian right in the United States because they are a grave danger in far more ways than merely their objection to abortion.
As to Muslims being too thin skinned, people who have been traditionally demonized and belittled for centuries tend to be that way. As some Jews, or American Blacks about that one. They should understand the phenomenon very well. And how interesting that so many people in this “progressive community” think that the best way to deal with people who they see as “too thin skinned” is to deliberately and unnecessarily poke at them with sharp sticks. Yeah, that’ll make them see things the right way!
I won’t take a photograph of an Amish person out of respect for their beliefs. And I won’t have any problem drawing a provocative image of Muhammed.
Why? Because the Amish ask us to leave them alone without running campaigns to ban cameras from stores, whereas this group of fundamentalist Muslims pressured nonbelievers to conform to their prescribed behaviors. Bullies should be stood up to.
So, in order to “teach a lesson” to a tiny group of “fundamentalist” Muslim outliers you are fine with offending the other two billion-plus Muslims. Great thinking.
I agree with Jon Stewart`s statement, “Revolution Muslim, your type of hatred and intolerance, that’s the enemy.” If 2-bllion Muslims are offended by this then let those 2-billion call out those extremists. Short of that I join the Jon Stewart Choir.
http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/04/jon-stewart-bring-backs-the-go-fck-yourself-choir-t
o-address-south-park-death-threats-video.php?ref=fpc
Muslims are not obligated to call out anyone, although many have done so. Odd how their voices don’t get heard, isn’t it?
Free speech, as 8 members of the Supreme Court just said, doesn’t depend on a balancing of relative social costs and benefits. The benefit of having free speech outweighs preventing it even when its social costs are greater than its benefits.
Anyway, I’m sure I’ve done many things during my life that would offend many of the two billion-plus Muslims or most strict adherents of other religions. I’m not going to tether my behavior to their approval.
But here are some social benefits of depicting Muhammed disrespectfully: It shows solidarity with artists who assert their right to offend parts of our society, letting them know that the risks they take on our behalf are appreciated. And it shows resistance to bullying. And maybe, just maybe, it will encourage two billion plus people to question the root of their offense and to ask to what extent are they comfortable telling people outside of their own religion how to behave? Under what circumstances do they think it’s acceptable to dictate to others how they can and cannot act?
All I have to do is turn on the TV, answer an unscreened phone call, deal with the bank or the cable company or the insurance company or “customer service”, look at the magazine section, overhear what’s being babbled about at the store or on the train, or just look around when I’m walking down the street, to find dozens or hundreds of shitpiles that offend me to the core. So I’m not inclined to give some special reverence to the offendedness of those who hold to one particular notion.
I wouldn’t dream of going into a mosque or cathedral or temple and defacing it or ranting about the stupidity of the beliefs it promotes. That doesn’t mean I assume some responsibility for avoiding any show of indifference or contempt for every cultural fetish on the planet. There is public space and there is private space, and the difference must be respected.
Even though daddyhood seems to be slowly turning you into some kind of warm pudding, Boo, I suspect you’d still defend the right to burn an American flag, call Obama a commie, or picture the Pope as a pimp. Face it: the only reason you make an exception for Muslim beliefs is that some of them are willing to kill to enforce their demands. Not a pretty sight.
I didn’t say that I don’t support South Park’s right to do whatever they want to do. I said I thought this was a dumb way to respond to death threats. And I didn’t base that on what the extremists will do. I based it on needlessly offending people who are not extremists.
Thanks, BooMan. Exactly one of the things I have been thinking too, only I didn’t verbalize it clearly at all and you did.
Let’s not get all lily-livered when it comes to standing up to those who have no respect for the freedoms that make this country great. I’m sick and tired of religious wackos fouling up this country with impunity. Sack up.
Damn right! Applies to wackos of any religious group.
When the Christian Right looks at “Islamofascists”, it’s like looking in a mirror. It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.