○ [Update-2] :: European lawmakers call for end to Turkey EU membership talks | Reuters |
Obama’s key ally in overthrow of Assad, FSA mixed with Al Qaeda rebels and NATO partner …
○ Turkish bill to clear men of child sex assault if they marry their victims | The Guardian |
[UPDATE-1] :: Islam and Child Marriage or Cruciating Rape
Legislation will be withdrawn waiting for a compromise.
Turkey to drop child-sex assault bill after protests | The Guardian |
The main opposition Republican People’s party (CHP) had called for the bill to be withdrawn and vowed to go as far as the constitutional court to block it.
But the Turkish government insisted it was trying to help families in which the men involved were not rapists or sexual aggressors, and who were unaware of the law. The legal age of consent in Turkey is 18 but child marriage is widespread, especially in the south-east of the country.
Even as he said the bill would be withdrawn, Yıldırım insisted that the proposals sought to rectify the situation for 3,800 families who “are forced to grow up without the love of their father” – likely imprisoned – and “paying for the mistakes of their mothers and fathers”.
But as well as opposition activists, the bill had also been criticised by the pro-government Women’s and Democracy Association (Kadem), whose deputy chairman is Erdoğan’s younger daughter, Sümeyye Erdoğan Bayraktar. It said in a statement on Friday that one of the bill’s biggest problems would be proving legally what constituted force or consent.
Campaigners have long accused the government of failing to do enough to stamp out child marriage and of paying more attention to pushing up the birth rate.
Motion to ‘protect child marriage’ in Turkey draws controversy | Middle East Eye |
○ Photo at rally against proposed government supported AKP bill
A woman holds sign saying "We will not forgive child rapists" at Istanbul rally (AFP)Erdoğan in June this year urged women to have at least three children and once described birth control as treason.
I am afraid this diary might be Islamophobic. Pedophilia is enthusiastically affirmed by Islam just as much as misogyny and homophobia are.
Therefore, I think it’s best for liberals not to talk about Islam at all, unless they want to accuse ordinary people, such as people who voted for Trump, of Islamophobia. In all other cases, leave discussion of Islam and Muslim countries to our masters, Hillary and Obama, and to people who self-identify as Muslims.
“I am afraid this comment might be Christianophobic. Pedophilia is enthusiastically affirmed by Christianity just as much as misogyny and homophobia are.
Therefore, I think it’s best for cons not to talk about Christianity at all, unless they want to accuse ordinary people, such as people who voted for Clinton, of Christianophobia. In all other cases, leave discussion of Christian leaders and countries to our master, Trump, and to people who self-identify as Christians.”
Fact free snark leads to this type of absurdity. Taking geographic, political, and situational factors out of the equation is a guarantee to make the problem worse. It is using a crisis to push your favored hobby horse, facts be damned.
Sadly, that has what has become of this blog. For all I know, that may be all that is left of the Democratic coalition before all is said and done. If so, we are well and truly up the proverbial creek.
What/who does ‘that’ refer to? I find the remark pretentious negativity. The direction the Left needs to take would be a wonderful subject for a diary. No one seems to know. The discussion is in full force. Maybe you’d be up to doing one? Anyway, don’t DailyKos us around hear. Right, DailyKos is a verb.
Whether you want to believe I’m “DailyKosing” (somehow sad that is apparently a verb now) you or anyone else is up to you. I have no control over that. If you want to see it that way, so it goes. Thanks for your concern.
And we get one more example.
.
Of what Nalbar?
Except that Turkey is not just any run-of-the-mill Muslim country, guys. It’s negotiating membership of the European Union and, as such, is fair game on all fronts. Like it or not, the EU does not condone the pardoning of child rapists if they marry their victims. No other way to look at it, I suppose. But Turkey can always throw in the EU towel with the approval of the Turks themselves by holding Erdogan’s hinted-at referendum on the issue. Has there ever been a woman who raped a minor male? Can she marry too? No guys, the matter is thoroughly obscene and should be recognised as such. The West has a very big finger the pie of its second-largest NATO member: Turkey. By the way, NATO = USA in case no one knows it.
Yeah, that EU membership was already looking dubious. Turkey must have decided to look elsewhere.
You have a viable solution?
A problem in my opinion is that many on the Left drank too much of the Obama Kool-Aid. The Obama “Lead from behind” messaging and the “Don’t do stupid shit” doctrine, while improvements over the Bush Doctrine, which itself was much more amorphous than the Right and Media Palin bashers were ever willing to admit, were short term solutions. Like most quick fixes they have created unintended consequences that are spiraling into as big or bigger problems than the ones originally addressed.
The reflexive reaction of many on the Left to side with Team Obama when Hillary criticized the DDSS policy was another incident of not seeing the merits and faults of both views. I had problems with her prescriptions, because I think she is an unabashed believer in American Exceptionalism. In addition, she seems too gullible to the mythical moderate rebels that so often are used to start the escalation process of using American ground troops when the rebels fail or need just a little more help. However, the way so many went #Never Hillary instinctively while disregarding the obvious shortcomings in his policy in reacting to events in Syria, Egypt, Libya, and now Turkey. The wait and see policy may turn out the better option, but not figuring out what went right in Tunisia and trying to have some sort of plan of replicating it if possible seems like a wasted opportunity on many levels. Perhaps, Tunisia was sui generis, I’ll admit my knowledge of the N. Africa and the Middle East is not very extensive.
Yes, the EU needs to tell Turkey to shove it. But to do so the EU will need the approval of the US because of NATO and all kinds of phantasmagorical ideas about geopolitics in the US, hegemony. I can’t grasp what your post is getting at: Obama and Clinton, Kool Aid and more. Is there something wrong about calling attention to this issue in Turkey? No one is advocating reviving the draft and sending masses of troops into Turkey to right this wrong. Or isn’t it wrong?
Your previous post didn’t address US policy when you wrote “US=NATO.” I found that to be a weakness, and I tried to add my thoughts to provide a fuller context. Not sure why you were lost, when others were not.
You don’t think Obama’s mixed message on Syria and the Turks relationship with the Kurds has caused some problems? I don’t mean to blame Obama too much for the situation, but he allowed a very free hand with Turkish overreach in the past. Erdogan seems to have taken that as weakness or an opportunity for his autocratic crackdown. Perhaps I am suffering from American Exceptionalism in thinking the U.S as an indispensable nation able to competently police other nations internal transgressions. Obama may have been unable to do much differently even with a well thought out comprehensive policy for the region.
NATO is not really designed to deal with internal chaos or governmental dysfunction in a client state. Kicking out Turkey would be a propaganda coup for radical Islamic groups. It would sow doubt in Eastern European countries unsure of the older states commitment since Turkey has been a member for over 60 years. It should benefit Russian interests in weakening both NATO and Turkey. Lastly, what do we do about the nuclear bombs located in Turkey? That is an issue regardless Turkey’s NATO membership status.
Oui, as Martin stated in a comment on another thread a few days ago, a one sentence diary is below the standard he expects here.
Don’t construe my criticism as any sort of endorsement for not being aware of the dreadful public policies wrt to sexual exploitation of children any country. Regardless if that’s done in a friendly or an enemy country. However, until we do much better in this country on this issue, we probably aren’t doing any young people any favors with an OMG! response to every report of more of the same out of certain countries.
Importance of the decision by AKP in parliament and lack of time the last few days forced my hand.
There were other priorities in real life for this hack and republican blogging issues @BT. 😉
h/t MoA – How White Helmets Videos Are Made
A second source – Syrian rebel media releases staged White Helmets rescue “mannequin challenge” video — then deletes it also archived original video and tweet.
The White Helmets’ public profile has been carefully cultivated by The Syria Campaign, an
advocacy group that lobbies for regime change on ostensible humanitarian grounds and that
was created by a Western PR firm, with the help of exiled Syrian-British billionaire Ayman Asfari.
○ Syria timeline
My earlier posts about the rebel forces’ “White Helmets”.
○ Americans Living In a Parallel Reality on Iraq and Syria
○ UK Commons Calling for WRexit In New Attack on Russia