[From the diaries by susanhbu] Does class matter? Education? Money? Religion?
“Being born in the elite in the U.S. gives you a constellation of privileges that very few people in the world have ever experienced,” Professor Levine said. “Being born poor in the U.S. gives you disadvantages unlike anything in Western Europe and Japan and Canada. NYT
Very interesting and enlightening article here:
Class Matters-
Shadowy Lines That Still Divide
By JANNY SCOTT and DAVID LEONHARDT
Published: May 15, 2005
There was a time when Americans thought they understood class. The upper crust vacationed in Europe and worshiped an Episcopal God. The middle class drove Ford Fairlanes, settled the San Fernando Valley and enlisted as company men. The working class belonged to the A.F.L.-C.I.O., voted Democratic and did not take cruises to the Caribbean.
Today, the country has gone a long way toward an appearance of classlessness. Americans of all sorts are awash in luxuries that would have dazzled their grandparents. Social diversity has erased many of the old markers. It has become harder to read people’s status in the clothes they wear, the cars they drive, the votes they cast, the god they worship, the color of their skin. The contours of class have blurred; some say they have disappeared.
But class is still a powerful force in American life. Over the past three decades, it has come to play a greater, not lesser, role in important ways. At a time when education matters more than ever, success in school remains linked tightly to class. At a time when the country is increasingly integrated racially, the rich are isolating themselves more and more. At a time of extraordinary advances in medicine, class differences in health and lifespan are wide and appear to be widening.
To see where you rate on the Class Chart go Here
I believe that Bushco and the politics of today are widening the class gap between the Haves and Have-nots- and that they are doing it on purpose. We have the Corporate Upper Class- The Walmart Culture and then the rest of us. Comments?
I averaged 54% and that’s on disability and what gets me bearly into the middleclass is my home-mobile home..
40th percentile…does that mean I’m classless…lol! Great diary Rosie!
I’m almost embarrassed to say that I averaged 88th percentile, primarily because of a degree in pharmacy…gosh that feels weird.
70th. . .after taking a significant income hit when I walked away from corporate America – but holding several professional designations allowing me to work in an “upper level” profession (when I’m in the mood).
I grew up in near poverty level income conditions, but we didn’t have a clue because my mother hand sewed beautiful clothes for all the kids and my father hand crafted doll houses and blocks from throw away lumber. Our bikes and furniture were second hand, but we didn’t care.
In those days, school children were required to complete questionnaires each year, and one of the questions actually asked what social class we belonged to. It never failed to tickle my parents when year after year all 6 of their children viewed our family as “upper middle class”. Leading to the point that class and wealth go far beyond money. (But any member of this community knows that already 🙂
I’m off to grab a glass of juice to settle in and see how well Dean does on MTP.
Although I’ve been told that I have no class, 88 with just my income, 91 including that of my wife.
I’ve often heard (and agreed with) the idea that most Americans think that they are in the middle – when they are actually not.
Working class folks often think that they are “middle-class” and therefore don’t support labor issues and government safety net programs because they think those are for “poor people” and they don’t need them. Until a layoff or a serious illness, etc strikes them. And often even then they see their situation as due to their own failure rather than to the failure of the system.
Upper middle class people think that they are middle class and that most people live the way they do – and again, don’t support safety net programs or ways to increase opportunity because they think that most people (people like them) don’t need them.
That said, I was very surprised to find myself in the “upper middle class” based on income. And that on a community college prof’s salary. I’ve felt lucky to be financially comfortable – which I define as not lying awake nights wondering if I’ll be able to pay the electric bill this month and having health insurance. But I really did think I was “middle middle” class.
really does it to you- my broke ass scores a 61, jumps to 90 if you include Ms. Cicero.
Whew- I always hope to marry up, now I can proove it. (Interestingly, Ms. Cicero goes from 88 w/o me to 90 w/ me. So she’ll have to keep me around to stay in the to 10 percent 😉
They are those who earn the middle third of dollars earned- thus the middle class are basically the 80-95 band on the gross income percentile scale.
Just the structure of the poll says a great deal about this country. For instance, farmers are ranked well below advertising managers, and there is no category under medical personnel for naturopaths, homeopaths, herbalists, or the people who actually heal you rather than pump you full of chemicals.
Your class rank is clearly all about how much money you have or can put your hands on fairly soon. Money is nice, no argument there, and I agree with Pearl Bailey: “I’ve been rich and I’ve been poor, and rich is better.”
But there are also issues of compassion, generosity (not just giving large checks to 501(c)3s), willingness to observe the altruistic principles on which we believe this country was founded. By those measures, I believe many of the people who would be ranked very high on this poll are really very low class. Call it lack of breeding, or the more modern term of no-‘count rich white trash, they infect the body politic.
Interesting observation. And from it one could conclude that class and morals are non-dependent. I would like to see a “what moral class do you fit in?” I bet I’d score higher.
Carpenters don’t get large numbers, but exactly in the middle is ok.
Sez one croc to another: “They all taste like chicken.”
Well I topped out at 35 and would no doubt have been much lower than that if not for my several years of college.
Class always has two meanings when describing people or what group they are in. I would be described as very very low class in terms of money and ownership. This to many peoples minds then automatically translates somehow into equating poor/low class into stupid/ignorant or lazy.
I can’t begin to tell you how many times based on my income I’ve had people in authority talk down to me simply due to knowing my income. I’ve even had several doctors tell me that ‘people like me shouldn’t be reading to much, it’s not good for you and to let people above me do the thinking’….That is not an isolated incident.
I even hesitated to put my ‘score’ on this site although I don’t believe the great people here who may recognize my name will start to discount anything I may have to say. Prejudice toward poor is pretty pervasive no matter what color you are.
“Prejudice toward poor is pretty pervasive…”
I couldn’t agree more-and it’s more and more acceptable, or maybe it just seems that way to me. I’m definitely poor, no bones about it, and I have also had people appear amazed that I read, am capable of half-way coherent thought, and so on.
The sad thing is that this prejudice, or at least lack of interest in the poor seems to come from both the right and the left. Best example here lately, there was a seminar on alternative energy/ self sufficiency in town. I was really interested. It seems logical that poor people have an even greater need than higher income folks to learn the best way to feed themselves, keep warm and get off the grid if possible.
The fee for my husband and myself was one half my weekly pay-so, no seminar for us.
That just feeds the old cliche-but one that is true-that to a certain extent poor people are kept poor by being excluded or denied so many things that the very rich are given for free.
Too bad about the seminar, that sounds like it would have been interesting.
I know of several projects here in CA. for solar panels on housing for the low income which is a good start at helping poor people to reduce monthly bills to be used on other things ..like more food etc.(I believe the actor Edward Norton has started this project several years ago)