If you haven’t read Charlie Wilson’s War: The Extraordinary Story of the Largest Covert Operation in History, you should. It recounts the CIA’s massive effort to kill Russians during the Soviet-Afghan War (1979-1989). The American people knew little about the CIA’s role in arming the mujahideen. The left was more focused on Central America and apartheid in South Africa. But there was another reason that the American people were largely uninformed: the Soviets barely complained. Why?
Well…it’s fairly simple. If the Russian people realized that the Americans were arming their Afghan foes then there would have been pressure on them to do something about it. And one of the main principles of the Cold War was that U.S. and Soviet forces would never confront each other directly, but only through proxy armies and other covert means. That meant that the Soviets were, by and large, willing to take enormous losses resulting from American assistance without much of a protest.
When you read Charlie Wilson’s War one of the things that will strike you is the zeal and enthusiasm our spooks had for killing Russians. They wanted revenge for Vietnam, and they wanted it badly. I don’t think anyone should be surprised if the Russian military is filled with veteran officers that feel the same way now, and want to pay us back for what we did to them in Afghanistan. If the Russians were arming the insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan, it would hardly be a great surprise. And if you go back to the first days of the war in Iraq you’ll see references to Russian military advisers helping Saddam.
Now, China is another story. China actually helped us work with the mujahideen during the Soviet-Afghan War. Some of the knock-off AK-47’s we supplied to the muj were made in Chinese factories (as well as Egyptian). But things may have changed.
There are scarcely any sources less credible than the Washington Times or any columnists more dishonest than Bill Gertz. So, take the following with a pillar of salt.
New intelligence reveals China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan, through Iran.
U.S. government appeals to China to check some of the arms shipments in advance were met with stonewalling by Beijing, which insisted it knew nothing about the shipments and asked for additional intelligence on the transfers. The ploy has been used in the past by China to hide its arms-proliferation activities from the United States, according to U.S. officials with access to the intelligence reports.
Some arms were sent by aircraft directly from Chinese factories to Afghanistan and included large-caliber sniper rifles, millions of rounds of ammunition, rocket-propelled grenades and components for roadside bombs, as well as other small arms.
The Washington Times reported June 5 that Chinese-made HN-5 anti-aircraft missiles were being used by the Taliban.
According to the officials, the Iranians, in buying the arms, asked Chinese state-run suppliers to expedite the transfers and to remove serial numbers to prevent tracing their origin. China, for its part, offered to transport the weapons in order to prevent the weapons from being interdicted.
The weapons were described as “late-model” arms that have not been seen in the field before and were not left over from Saddam Hussein’s rule in Iraq.
U.S. Army specialists suspect the weapons were transferred within the past three months.
The Bush administration has been trying to hide or downplay the intelligence reports to protect its pro-business policies toward China, and to continue to claim that China is helping the United States in the war on terrorism. U.S. officials have openly criticized Iran for the arms transfers but so far there has been no mention that China is a main supplier.
Defense officials are upset that Chinese weapons are being used to kill Americans. “Americans are being killed by Chinese-supplied weapons, with the full knowledge and understanding of Beijing where these weapons are going,” one official said.
I am not vouching for Bill Gertz’s assertions here. There is an obvious agenda from the ‘GET IRAN NOW’ caucus, and it appears this article is just part of their black propaganda campaign. What I want to talk about though is the irony that would be involved if this report were true.
In the 1980’s, we used Pakistan as our staging point for arming the mujahideen. In this case, China is using Iran. That makes sense both because we are still allied with Pakistan and because Iran borders Iraq, as well as Afghanistan. The weapons are stripped of identifying markers, hiding their origin. This was the point of our supplying the mujahideen with only (knock-off) Russian weapons made in Egypt and China. It allowed us plausible deniability. The ‘Bush administration has been trying to hide or downplay the intelligence reports to protect its pro-business policies toward China’ just as the Gorbachev administration downplayed the CIA’s role because they didn’t want to risk a major confrontation with the United States. Naturally, this wound up infuriating both Soviet generals (then) and American generals (now) who knew their soldiers were getting killed.
In other words, if you just change the names around (USSR becomes USA, Pakistan becomes Iran, USA becomes China, Afganistan remains Afghanistan, but add in Iraq) this is a total repeat of the ass-whupping we put on the Soviets, only now it is our turn to take a beating.
So, Gertz may be pushing some disinformation, but it is dripping in irony. And if he is right, we should be worried about what happened to the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics happening to the United States of America.
If China is doing this, you might wonder if they are experiencing some of the same confusion John Stewart has in determining who our enemies are (this is a wonderful example about the value of Stewart and Colbert’s role in pointing out the “irony” of our current policy – from C&L)
But, more seriously, here’s a profound statement of warning:
And if he is right, we should be worried about what happened to the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics happening to the United States of America.
Indeed.
And since China actually pays for the GWOT they get to collect interest (bankrupt us) at the same time they kill our boys and girls.
If this is true, it is a very bad sign. We’ll never admit they’re doing it and our ability to retaliate is virtually nil.
When I saw the CNN show about Time Magazine picking their “Person of the Year” for 2006 and they considered President Hu Jintao of China, my reacting was – “boring.” But the more I pay attention, the more I think it was prescient. I think we need to pay alot more attention to China…our lives may depend on it.
its like perfect karma
china has become us on so many levels
communism failed because it became a dictatorship of the proletariot….so they are moving towards capitalism.
now capitalism has become a dictatorship of the proletariot…..and its failing….and moving towards what? i suspect something close to feudalism…which is a system that failed 400 years ago.
thru all this, the rich people, whether monarchists left over from the fuedal society, communists, or capitalists, have become richer and garnered more power…poor people have become more poor, more numerous and more powerless.
how does this end?
Also available in orange.
That argument parallels a key assertion made by Cheney and other neo-conservative officials in constructing the case for war against Iraq in 2002. They insisted that any contact between an official of the Iraqi government at any level and anyone in al-Qaeda was sufficient proof of the government’s support for al-Qaeda terrorism.
Afghanistan specialist Seth Jones of the Rand Corporation, who visited Afghanistan most recently this year, said some elements of the Iranian government may be involved in arms trafficking but it is “very small-scale support” and Iran does not want to strengthen the Taliban.
NATO commanders in Pakistan have long been aware that the Taliban have been dependent on Pakistan for their arms and ammunition. The London Telegraph reported on Sunday that a NATO report on a recent battle shows that the Taliban fired an estimated 400,000 rounds of ammunition, 2,000 rocket-propelled grenades and 1,000 mortar shells and had stocked more than a million rounds of ammunition, all of which came from Quetta, Pakistan, during the spring months.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/IF13Ak02.html
Bankrupting the U.S. –
http://inteldaily.com/?c=139&a=2378
I don’t know if China and Iran are supplying arms to Iran, but you could scarcely call it cause for concern as a new datum bound to affect events
http://proctoringcongress.blogspot.com/2007/03/gao-unsecured-munitions-responsible-for.html
People can scarce be blamed for confusion. This one I just stumbled across – checking my trapline -exempifies the abundance of stupidity in the world.
http://bluegirlredmissouri.blogspot.com/
Sat June 16 28%? Time to whip up some Iran frenzy, I guess.
It’s rather nuts when I check ‘questionable sources’ ahead of mainstream media for an idea of what’s really happening in the world.
I remain convinced that the only reason the Russians and the Chinese put up so much resistance to the Security Council resolution that led to this war was so the Americans wouldn’t become suspicious when they finally rolled over and let us have the thrashing we had been begging for throughout the Cold War. If Moscow and Beijing are genuinely unhappy about the American intervention in Iraq, it is only because they cannot afford to gloat publicly.
Well, if the truth were known about Chechnya and how the Russians flipped Zawahiri…
Do tell, please; don’t just leave the uninitiated hanging! A place to get background would be great. : -)
Alexander Litivenko:
New Statesman:
Immediately after his release, his strategy changed.
Thank you for taking the time! After my post I realized you might not come back to check older posts (you’re a busy man!) and did a little checking, finding this as a starter:
http://www.financialsense.com/stormwatch/geo/pastanalysis/2002/0716.html
Again, thank you.
As I said, Zawahiri was flipped.
Politicians want us to consider each event as a single thing. Your very interesting diary reminds us that NOTHING exists ipso facto and de neuvo. Rather, all things exist in a mileau of historical reasoning.
I am certain, as you note, that the Russians are sitting back and saying “We lost in Afghanistan. It is now your turn to lose in Afghanistan.” In the 1800s, the British lost in Afghanistan. Every colonial power that has invaded Afghanistan has lost.
Bush is going to go down in history as a unique president. He will be the only president in history to lose 2 wars.
We must ensure that Bush is given the SOLE RESPONSIBILITY for these losses.