i have read that a 13 year old girl was among the arrested.
she will be a radical for the rest of her life.
these kids have balls, Steven. Serious. Fuckin’ Balls. blocking traffic on the brooklyn bridge, holy shit.
Speaking just for myself, I’m all for democracy and the demanding thereof. However, at some point, amorphous social movements need to incarnate into organizations with recognized leaders and followers who can negotiate terms with their opponents.
When and how that best happens? Who knows. But it’s a real and important challenge for Occupy Wall Street, and for their allies (and prospective allies).
I’d suggest the 1989 June 4th Chinese student movement in Tienanmen Square as an example of a social movement that failed to make that transition, to the detriment of the movement, the state and the wider society. (Others are more knowledgeable than I about the June 4th incident, so please correct me where I’m wrong.)
Specific demands are irrelevant. Any demands they made would not be granted anyway, but letting the discussion move to that arena allows for dry technical obfuscary (it’s a word now) in which only the views of the other side would be respected. The blogosphere is the place for that kind of discussion. These protests are about creating a movement, and the point is that Wall Street is to blame and should be held accountable. That is enough. That is the point at which the discussion begins, not where it ends.
More rapidly than I could ever have imagined, this movement is reaching the break-out point. It is quite possible that the Bloomberg centurions will be able to do nothing to stop it now. Ignore it and it will just sit there gumming up the works in the financial heartland of America and thus monopolizing the attention of the media which are owned by the denizens of that conscienceless heartland. Actively attack it and it will grow geometrically.
Police re-opened the Brooklyn Bridge Saturday afternoon after arresting over 700 protesters who were marching on the bridge and blocking traffic. The protest was part of the Occupy Wall Street movement.
There have been a lot of comments about the courage of these protesters. What has been striking is the training, logistics, and tactical discipline the protests have attained in two weeks with what really are from a training standpoint large numbers.
An example. The selection of the Brooklyn bridge was a good choice because it automatically reduces the number of police while showing the scale of the march. Maybe not the 10,000 cops who marched against a civil review board in 1992, but still large.
There are still questions about whether the march was linked up to two protests that successfully crossed the bridge yesterday. And there are questions about who led the part of the march that went onto the roadway. But the determinative evidence is that the NYPD stopped traffic on the bridge before the head of the march reached the bridge. Traffic was stopped for four hours.
After being kettled between two lengths of orange netting, the protesters sat down, locked arms, and the police had the task of removing them one or two at a time. To have that many people have that degree of discipline shows training in nonviolent civil disobedience methods.
The arrests were done primarily by senior (white-shirted) officers, with blue-shirted officers just escorting the people arrested to waiting vans and buses. In one video the senior officer in charge appears to be dressing down one of his subordinates for being too aggressive.
Reports are that all persons arrested will be charged with disorderly conduct.
The Revolution was the Continental Army, it wasn’t the Declaration of Independence. The Continental Army was a year old when the Declaration was issued.
People have to decide what they want. The storming of the Tuilleries, or the U.K. General Election of 1945.
They’re both noteworthy examples of the outcome of a movement, but they’re very, very different outcomes.
Most everything in the middle has proven a disappointment. A liberal version of Boulangism isn’t a step forward.
What you do depends on what you want. You plan backwards.
As the Occupy Wall St protests continue to spread, a call out has been made for Melbourne, Brisbane , Sydney, Adelaide and Perth
to join the global day of action United for Global Change on October 15th.
« click
Occupy Melbourne has stated the aim of
“NON-VIOLENTLY sending a message to the financial sector worldwide. Australia too is under the same bind of freedom
because of monetary policy and corporate greed. Show your support for Occupy Wall Street! Occupy Australia!!!”
i have read that a 13 year old girl was among the arrested.
she will be a radical for the rest of her life.
these kids have balls, Steven. Serious. Fuckin’ Balls. blocking traffic on the brooklyn bridge, holy shit.
I still don’t know what the heck it is they are protesting and what specific demands they are making.
Why do they need specific demands? Demanding democracy and not oligarchy isn’t good enough for you?
Speaking just for myself, I’m all for democracy and the demanding thereof. However, at some point, amorphous social movements need to incarnate into organizations with recognized leaders and followers who can negotiate terms with their opponents.
When and how that best happens? Who knows. But it’s a real and important challenge for Occupy Wall Street, and for their allies (and prospective allies).
I’d suggest the 1989 June 4th Chinese student movement in Tienanmen Square as an example of a social movement that failed to make that transition, to the detriment of the movement, the state and the wider society. (Others are more knowledgeable than I about the June 4th incident, so please correct me where I’m wrong.)
leaders are inconspicuous at first sometimes, cf arab spring.
likewise this is internet driven.
Specific demands are irrelevant. Any demands they made would not be granted anyway, but letting the discussion move to that arena allows for dry technical obfuscary (it’s a word now) in which only the views of the other side would be respected. The blogosphere is the place for that kind of discussion. These protests are about creating a movement, and the point is that Wall Street is to blame and should be held accountable. That is enough. That is the point at which the discussion begins, not where it ends.
http://nycga.cc/2011/09/30/declaration-of-the-occupation-of-new-york-city/
Me either. And it’s hard to be impressed by training, logistics and tactical discipline when they ended up on the Brooklyn Bridge.
700 arrested, eh?
Hmmmmm…
More rapidly than I could ever have imagined, this movement is reaching the break-out point. It is quite possible that the Bloomberg centurions will be able to do nothing to stop it now. Ignore it and it will just sit there gumming up the works in the financial heartland of America and thus monopolizing the attention of the media which are owned by the denizens of that conscienceless heartland. Actively attack it and it will grow geometrically.
Hmmmmmm…
Mubarak Land?
NewBarack Land?
The reaction to the Arabic Spring?
The American Autumn?
Hmmmmmm…
Could be.
As I wrote here (War + Revolution as Earthbound, Traveling Infections) on May 22, 2011:
Hmmmm…
Check it out.
May you be born into interesting times.
AG
.
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."There have been a lot of comments about the courage of these protesters. What has been striking is the training, logistics, and tactical discipline the protests have attained in two weeks with what really are from a training standpoint large numbers.
An example. The selection of the Brooklyn bridge was a good choice because it automatically reduces the number of police while showing the scale of the march. Maybe not the 10,000 cops who marched against a civil review board in 1992, but still large.
There are still questions about whether the march was linked up to two protests that successfully crossed the bridge yesterday. And there are questions about who led the part of the march that went onto the roadway. But the determinative evidence is that the NYPD stopped traffic on the bridge before the head of the march reached the bridge. Traffic was stopped for four hours.
After being kettled between two lengths of orange netting, the protesters sat down, locked arms, and the police had the task of removing them one or two at a time. To have that many people have that degree of discipline shows training in nonviolent civil disobedience methods.
The arrests were done primarily by senior (white-shirted) officers, with blue-shirted officers just escorting the people arrested to waiting vans and buses. In one video the senior officer in charge appears to be dressing down one of his subordinates for being too aggressive.
Reports are that all persons arrested will be charged with disorderly conduct.
The Revolution was the Continental Army, it wasn’t the Declaration of Independence. The Continental Army was a year old when the Declaration was issued.
People have to decide what they want. The storming of the Tuilleries, or the U.K. General Election of 1945.
They’re both noteworthy examples of the outcome of a movement, but they’re very, very different outcomes.
Most everything in the middle has proven a disappointment. A liberal version of Boulangism isn’t a step forward.
What you do depends on what you want. You plan backwards.
.
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."