We’re going to have to take a deep dive into the following analysis by Brendan Nyhan of the New York Times because if we allow the debate on the left to get bogged down in an either/or dispute on these terms, it’s a recipe for disaster.
In the choices that he makes, Mr. Trump may play down conflict over the size and scope of government and shift the political debate toward questions of national identity, immigration and culture…
…Mr. Trump’s success is likely to provoke a response from Democrats that could accelerate this shift. They face an outraged liberal base that is likely to reject conciliatory messages intended to win back votes among the white working class.
The party might instead double down on cosmopolitan appeals to the minority voters and college-educated white voters who were the main target of Hillary Clinton’s campaign. The strategy failed in 2016, but the incentive to try again is clear. Democrats came closer to winning several Sun Belt states where minority and college-educated white populations are growing, like Arizona and Georgia, than they did some traditional Midwest strongholds with higher numbers of noncollege whites, like Ohio and Iowa.
A focus on cosmopolitanism might make electoral sense for Democrats given the changing demographics of the country, but it could further weaken their appeal to whites without college degrees, dividing the electorate by race and class even more.
Since the election, I’ve identified the left’s electoral problem as primarily rural in nature. By this I mean two things that you may not expect. First, I don’t define the “problem” as exclusively or even primarily an Electoral College problem. It’s a problem that makes it nearly impossible to win control of the U.S. House of Representatives or of an unacceptably large percentage of the state legislatures in the country. Second, I do not mean that the Democrats can or should expect to win in rural areas, or that that they should craft their programs and messaging to appeal to rural voters in any kind of preferential way or in a way that “sells-out” or diminishes their own true base.
Before anything else, the political costs of losing the rural vote need to be understood. I’ve gone over the presidential election results several times already, but the short version is that Clinton did not suffer from underperformance (compared to Obama in 2012) in the cities of her targeted states and that she over performed in terms of both support and turnout in many suburbs (including my own Philly suburbs). She lost because she was slaughtered in rural counties that gave about 70% of their votes to Romney and gave about 80% of their votes to Trump.
On the one hand, we’re only talking about a relatively modest shift (although in some counties the shift was very large and pronounced). But, on the other hand, the results speak for themselves. The threat to the left is that these rural counties will begin to vote in a habitual way based on the consensus view that the Democratic Party is anti-white and the GOP is pro-white. I called this the Southification of the North and it’s something that can, regrettably, be considered the true accomplishment of the Trump campaign and movement.
This is something I warned about in 2013, long before Trump announced he was running for president.
The only hope for a racial-polarization strategy is to get the races to segregate their votes much more thoroughly, and that requires that more and more whites come to conclude that the Democratic Party is the party for blacks, Asians, and Latinos.
That is, indeed, how the party is perceived in the Deep South, but it would be criminal to expand those racial attitudes to the country at large.
The Republicans are coalescing around a strategy that will, by necessity, be more overtly racist than anything we’ve seen since segregation was outlawed.
This is what Trump attempted and it is what explains his election.
Now, what Brendan Nyhan is warning us about is that we may inadvertently reinforce this strategy, solidify it, and make it permanent by “doubl[ling] down on cosmopolitan appeals to the minority voters and college-educated white voters” and making rhetorical war on rural voters, their values, and their decision to embrace Trumpism.
And, it’s true. If the left’s response has the effect of turning these rural counties into solid red bastions of anti-Democratic Party sentiment where the party cannot get more than 20% of the vote, then that will be a dream come true for the right. Here in Pennsylvania, for example, the suburbs will probably turn against Trump’s administration with real fury, making the state blue again in 2020. But that won’t make it possible for the Democrats to win control of the state legislature in 2020 or at any time in the foreseeable future. It will also limit how many congressional seats are competitive, making a takeover of the U.S. House of Representative a much steeper climb. And the same phenomenon will take place throughout the midwest.
This was already a problem that had arisen during the Obama administration, but there’s a big enough difference between the 2012 and 2016 results to turn a problem into a crisis.
Now, the difficulty arises when you go from identifying the threat to attempting to craft a response to it. It’s too easy to see the solution as some form of “making nice” with racism or in making some kind of accommodation to misogyny and homophobia. People try to define this as a choice between pursuing the “culture wars” vs. abandoning that in favor of economic populism.
That cannot be the choice for both reasons of principle and common sense. Any strategy that doesn’t account for human nature is bound to fail. When a political movement, elected with a minority of the popular vote, pursues policies that aggressively attack the civil rights of your base, your base has the right to expect you to fight back with everything you have. This isn’t an option if you want to be a successful and cohesive political organization.
So, how do you do this without solidifying the rural counties against the Democratic Party?
It’s particularly challenging because the right’s entire strategy will be to make this change permanent. Trump’s reelection completely depends on it. In fact, because his suburban support will almost surely erode, he’ll need these rural counties to go to 85% or 90% support.
The answer to this conundrum lies first in understanding what your political opponents need to do and in not making their job easier. That will require discipline because they want to bait you into reacting in a way that alienates their core supporters. But it also requires a really aggressive effort to explain to these voters that your party doesn’t consider them the enemy and wants their votes. They will never give the left a majority of their votes, or anything close to a majority. But that’s not what is required. Winning 30% was enough to get President Obama reelected. Winning 35% would begin to put state legislatures back in play.
Now, there are a lot of ways in which the Democrats can go about competing better in these counties, and I welcome all suggestions. Since a lot of this is more about identity politics than policy, candidate recruitment is an important factor. Policy cannot be ignored, however, and these communities have real concerns that the Democrats can take the lead on addressing. One obvious area is tackling the opioid epidemic. Another is the one I have been focusing on which is using anti-trust law to bring back small business ownership in rural America. This should be coupled with a set of policies aimed at empowering people to learn the skills and get access to the capital to start small businesses. The promise isn’t to bring back the factories but to bring back the Mom and Pop hardware stores and banks and pharmacies. These are businesses that cannot be outsourced and that used to be privately owned instead of franchised.
Perhaps the national Democratic Party will be somewhat divided on these issues, but nothing prevents populist Democrats from running on this set of policies in rural communities all over the country.
Either way, the party needs to invest in outreach and not let any of these communities drift into near-universal Republicanism without a fight.
Now, as I’ve said, a strategy that doesn’t account for human nature will fail, and the left is going to allow itself to be baited because most people (of all persuasions) take the bait. That’s why this strategy relies on leadership. The people who serve as the face of the Democratic Party need to avoid the temptation to get easy approval when that is the exact trap that is being laid for them.
They have to learn to fight with one hand and turn the other cheek with the other. The key here is to offer respect even when no respect is offered and when little seems warranted. The more rank-and-file Democrats that realize this the better, but most of them won’t, and that’s okay. That’s human nature. The leaders, however, have to get this balance right, and they need to devote adequate resources to the problem.
Pretty solid mission statement.
I’s also point out that Harry Enten at 538 makes a case that the exit polls are closer to the reality than Latino Decidions in terms of Latino vote share. Which suggests there are hard limits to democratic identity politics.
Hispanics ARE mainstream in most of Texas. Maybe the agricultural areas of the Valley have been slower, but we have a merged culture for the most part. Class determines voting patterns much more than race, now, imo.
As someone born and raised in MN immigration is not the animating force for me. Yes I think we need a better system. Many Democrats constantly try to use it as a shorthand for Latino issues. But my family has been here for over a century and it would take constitutional amendments to strip my cirizenship.
Very much in agreement with the overall plan. I have to question one specific, the idea of aggressive anti-trust enforcement on rural stores and factories. While I agree this would be good policy, we’re looking for things to draw votes, which we’re not getting in spite of already having policies more friendly to the rural working class. Would this actually get any votes? My impression from second-hand connections is that virtually none of the voters we want would respond to an anti-trust policy. The route to benefits to them is just too abstract.
People LOVE WalMart. Shoot, my city has TWO, not six miles apart. And Home Depot’s (which are a fucking God send) are in every city.
Going after anti-trust like that will be framed by republicans as elites (who don’t have a clue how ‘real ‘mericans live) trying to kill cheap prices and micro manage how people want to shop.
.
In fact if the anti-trust policy is premised on attacking big box stores and online retail so rural communities can build Potemkin mom-and-pop stores it’s likely to drive away far more voters than it would win. Online retail especially has been an enormous boon to rural living.
I think tying the big chain stores to globalization and sucking dollars out of the local economy would work.
Anti-trust is also a big issue for health care. Exactly what happens with Obamacare from here on is still to be seen.
http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/newsletters/washington-health-policy-in-review/2015/dec
/dec-21-2015/obamacare-antitrust-laws-can-coexist
People have to decide what it is they want from goverment. Poor people want money. Rich people want to be left alone (and they want money too!)
Politicians, on the other hand, want power. To hell with them.
Perhaps it is time to reduce our expectations. I want the government to be irrelevant. I want it to stop killing people half way around the world. I want it to process a few benefits and then just go away.
And really… drug treatment? That’s how we’re supposed to garner support in the Midwest? No.
Do your yourself and find a parent support group in your area and go attend it as an anthropologist. See who the people are who are attending, what their status is in the community and what they want from the government as regards addiction treatment.
You’ll find the place filled with lawyers and doctors and other professionals.
Lower down the class line, the people don’t show up for such meetings but want the same things, even more desperately.
I assume you have read that medical marijuana has been useful in treating opioid addiction and as a replacement in pain mitigation programs.
I expect Republicans to be much worse than Dems in disrepecting state decisions on this issue. But Dems are not together on it either…
I’m just having a hard time imagining that family and friends of drug addicts voted for trump (or didn’t vote at all) out of frustration that goverment didn’t do something to help. I get that you have a personal interest in this issue, but as strategy this seems irrelevant to the political problem facing democrats. No one looks to the GOP or trump for help with a personal problem. They look the GOP to punish people they don’t like.
You need to get out more:
Well there you go. I’m sure there are lots of reasons people use drugs. I had mine… Chad had his. Moms never understand.
yes, the drug use is a problem but it’s a symptom. must look at the underlying cause
Wishing it so does nothing to create that reality. This is delusional thinking, if you aren’t willing to actually do anything.
All those with unrealized goals are delusional to imagine a different situation I suppose. Or perhaps your word choice is just unfortunate… and a bit condescending.
I don’t want much… but apparently low expectations are too much to ask for? What? I must ask for more?
You make absolute blanket statements about millions of people. You condemn all politicians based on a logical fallacy. Then by avoiding what I actually wrote, you create your own straw man to ride off on your high horse of being offended. Does this work in your personal life?
No, I am just asking, are you doing anything about it other than hoping for the best? So many people on the internet think voting and posting their thoughts are enough. You have to be engaged and active. Run for office. Work to build a better more responsive Democratic Party on the local level. Build a viable 3rd party, if that is your inclination.
I am just tired of people that have endless hours to waste online, yet can’t be bothered to register, vote, volunteer, or run. I am not condescending. I am condemning apathy, laziness, and faux outrage.
I have a real job. It’s Saturday.
Maybe you could tell us how you are engaged, involved, active or whatever? Maybe you’re not.
I volunteer for candidates. I will most likely be my precinct captain very soon, and i am thinking about running for a position on the County board. I was asked in the past, but felt unqualified and too busy. I know longer feel that way.
You do anything Quentin?
You are right. I have no clue how to revive the Democratic Party’s prospects after this:
“The Democratic Party is a smoking crater. Despite winning more votes at the national level, and more votes for the House of Representatives, the party has lost the presidency, Congress, 69 percent of state legislatures, and 33 governorships. Republicans are only a handful of state houses away from being able to amend the Constitution on a party line vote.”
https:/theweek.com/articles/662514/how-democratic-party-rebuild
No one is going to change the economic system. Booman’s suggestion about anti-trust enforcement is welcome but heck… that ship sailed decades ago. The damage is done.
https:
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/11/trump-antitrust-barry-lynn/507917
“One of the things that we’ve seen over the last generation with the rise of monopoly is, when you have a monopoly here in the United States, it means that you don’t really have to manufacture things in the States–you can actually make more money if you outsource the things that used to be manufactured here to some place where the quality of the goods is not as high. You don’t have to have your eyeball on the actual manufacturing process, since there’s no real competition.”
I can personally attest to the disruption to workers lives resulting from merger after merger in the industry in which I work. It is an endless story of plant closings and dislocation exacerbated by automation and globalization.
Meanwhile, the financiers are doing their thing too:
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/11/activist-investors/506330/
“But it’s activist investors who have really pushed short-term thinking and figured out how to profit from it, according to Stout. And data suggests that, on the whole, activist investors are not good for employees or for the economy. Companies targeted by activist investors saw employment drop by 4 percent between 2008 and 2013, while all companies on average grew employment nine percent, on average, according to a 2015 study, “Hedge Fund Activism: Preliminary Results and Some New Empirical Evidence,” by Yvan Allaire, executive chair of the Institute for Governance of Private and Public Organizations, a Canadian think tank that works on governance issues. Those who had specifically been targeted by activists advocating for cost reduction saw employment shrink 20 percent.”
These are the things that destroyed the middle class. All this operates outside the control of government. It is the economic system that has been created for us with the bipartisan consent of the political class. None of this was going to be changed by President Clinton. None of it was affected by President Obama.
By all means, focus on the defense of the social safety net these next few years, but the democratic party has no credibility on economic issues beyond that because they have been complicit in the creation of this system. Some have acknowledged that they oversold the benefits of globalization and free trade, but cheap t-shirts at Walmart aren’t really helping anyone. The damage is done. I don’t imagine anything can be done to fix it now. I don’t imagine the looters in the political class are even seriously interested in trying.
Glad Gandhi and MLK didn’t feel this hopeless. 😉
The struggles we face now are no worse than the ones we faced in the Great Depression and then WW II. Too much of the lower level apparatus and unions are gone or in severe disrepair, but we have to start rebuilding somewhere. The question is if we have enough time left or it is too late.
This your best analysis since the election.
One of the problems as mino stated is the later generations of ethnic groups will identify more with the perceived majority, whether you call it the mainstream or white. People from outside of Texas don’t understand why Hispanics don’t vote like other Hispanics nationally, and it is because many can trace their roots back 6-8 generations in Texas. They have been there longer than the Anglos. This the flaw in the current identity politics of the Democratic Party. Not getting 40% of white voters and +30% of the rural vote the next few cycles will create a semi-permanent minority status for the Dems. Hoping for 75-80% of POC is expecting too much work from a too vulnerable and too small subset.
I agree with what you say here.
I would add that despite that, Texas really is trending more, not less, competitive for Democrats. Although Clinton lost statewide by 9.1%, this is 6.7% better than Obama did in 2012. More details here:
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article114863163.html
How can we improve our ability to spot the bait and traps more quickly?
As voters or politicians?
The Right learned many lessons from the Civil Rights Movement that the Left has either forgotten or no longer thinks are appropriate. I think this is serious mistake.
Accept that there is no longer any reason to trust that the right is an honest broker in a deal.
One high profile issue for rurals for sure. No privatizing the Post Office.
A post office offering banking and no fee debit cards as a public service would distance Dems from Wall Street on a vital service rurals depend upon. AND it’s in the Constitution!
USPS used to offer simple banking and still offers money orders and cashes them. The banks want them to stop the money orders. Don’t recall when the banking ended. 1950’s I think. Argument was made that S&L’s could do the job and they did until “reform” let contractors buy them and use them as private piggy banks.
The Guardian — President-elect: I had to settle Trump University case ‘to focus on our country’
With this done deal, I don’t ever want to hear a single partisan Republican ever again bring up the Paula Jones settlement. However, as Trump is such a notorious cheapskate have my doubts that “time” was his only consideration in agreeing to pay out $25 million dollars. Trump U was a scam and fleeced naive and/or gullible people and our governments should be in the business of closing down crooked operations like Trump U that cons ordinary and unsuspecting people out of serious money.
USAToday – Donald Trump, Mitt Romney hold ‘far-reaching’ talk on world affairs
Mitt is a hollow, shameless, suck-up man. A real life Eddie Haskell. No wonder that 3% of the population that decide presidential elections experienced him as oily.
Is the answer not: unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions, unions?
Unions would help, but we don’t get them until we get them. It’s more a spoil of success than a strategy for it.
The answer is jobs. When was the last time affordable housing was built in rural America? How about some energy independence for rural America? Rural America needs the right to reject fracking/mining/pipelines in their communities. The list is endless.
Well, right now I see the left having a massive temper tantrum over the president elect. In fact, I know a couple folks so hopped up on left wing conspiracy nonsense–the DNC rigged the primary–they didn’t even vote but are angry now. Online, I’ve seen the T. Frank theory bought in total, with nary a conversation about how ahistorical some of his nonsense is. The DLC did it! Clintonistas did it! Wait what? Clinton won the White House twice after three presidential elections where Democrats got thwacked?
Fact is, we got a lot of rural and less liberal Congressmen in 2006 and 08 into Congress. The left couldn’t stand some of them. Obamacare’s atrocious, Dodd-Frank didn’t wreck the banks, and the left sat at home in 2010. Reading what I’ve read online this last week gives me little hope that left can manage having a caucus that includes more conservative members anymore.
In their search for a permanent political ascendancy that will ensure segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever the white nationalists have supplanted the leadership in the Republican Party once held by conservatives. Many of their principles are diametrically opposed, but at bottom their political action acts as a veal pen to deliver a compliant bunch of white folks as support for an increasingly distant 0.01% of primarily white Americans who bought access to Congress. And they did it by avoiding actual political conversation and debate. When the nostrums they force on Congress fail, it will not be them who are held accountable for pushing the ideas and having members of Congress, judges, and state legislators snap to, it will be the opposition who pointed out exactly how they would fail who will be the scapegoats or minorities, who are cast as “losers”. Nyhan points to this party realignment, but poses the “cosmopolitans” as the foil to white ethnic party. That is stereotyping on both sides, although a permanent Republican dominance of US politics has been a long term goal of conservatives.
BooMan has accurately focused on the danger of hypermajority jurisdictions as being not allowed to freeze into captive constituencies as the elected officials chose their voters instead of the voters choosing them. So what does outreach to these commmunities look like in a practical sense. Some of the kum ba ya tactics suggested so far open up closure of attitudes and the branding of the actions as the desperation of “losers”.
Only the small numbers of Democratic voters who actually live in these jurisdictions can provide insight for what the issue is in each one. Thirty years ago in Ellijay GA, the principle issue was the sheriff of the county was dealing drugs and held the town in a grip of silence. A smaller scale version of the grip Joe Arpaio held on Maricopa County AZ. How do you deal with that as it reflects out in up-ballot offices?
There are more options than fighting and appeasement. Even that imagery seems off. What exactly does fighting look like for people not resident in these jurisdictions? Where does this fight take place? When is not being precipitate prudence and when appeasement? Who is doing the collective deciding here? Who is “the party”?
States used to subsidize more school jobs in these counties than prison jobs. In many states, this has reversed as schools have been starved from the state legislature downward. A lot of states used to have distributed road crews to maintain roads; now they hire multi-state contractors. The federal government and states used to subsidize county hospitals, and local health departments used to function as clinics for everyone in the county for some issues. Rural transportation for those without cars used to be a priority for states, but no longer. So much of what goes on in rural counties is bound up in some degree of shame — domestic violence, addiction to alcohol or drugs, sexual assault and violence. So much economic activity is informal. Some economic activity is illegal for one jurisdiction or another. Public lands increasingly are looked upon as having been stolen instead of purchased from earlier owners. In many counties of North Carolina, the first government employee they ever saw was the postmaster. The second was the revenuer. The third was the National Forest, National Park Service, or Corps of Engineers surveyor and purchasing agent.
Overlooked is how much rural land is owned by large corporations and dominated by them as much as government dominates the land of some jurisdictions.
As agriculture increases in scale, smaller units of production have a harder time keeping up income.
How many Democrats are fluent in how farming areas operate? How many can talk “tobacco allotments” with landowners in former tobacco country (NC, VA. MD, WV, KY)? How many understand what the Department of Agriculture at the federal or state level actually does and how well they do it? How many know which communities are dependent on railway access and where the track runs? How many understand forestry as a crop? Authentic and not BS knowledge. An ability to understand the currently discussed issues.
Build and help the local Domocratic organizations. Not the state parties, but the ones at the local level. They are mostly run by committed volunteers, who have to somehow balance their work, their families and their support for Democrats. They get little help from the state parties and almost none from the co-ordinated campaigns.
Voting comes from the bottom up. The Republicans have been great at taking over School Boards, city councils, etc. The Democrats need to step up.
As Tip O’Neill used to say “All politics is local.”
You are right. That’s why I’m looking to attend my next county meeting. I live in a blood red area of California. I’m never going to make a difference bitching online is what this election taught me.
“did not suffer from underperformance (compared to Obama in 2012) in the cities of her targeted states and that she over performed in terms of both support and turnout in many suburbs”
As I have shown in my diary about Florida this is factually incorrect. Florida was lost in the ring counties around Tampa and Orlando. The ring counties around Cuyahoga County (Cleveland) in Ohio were the source of some of the largest decline in Ohio.
Michigan and Wisconsin were lost by under performance in the key Democratic Counties of Wayne and Milwaukee.
You can’t diagnose the problem if you don’t know what it is.
With respect to Florida and Ohio Booman does not. Nor is he correct about Michigan and Wisconsin.
What about Pennsylvnia? Brandon Finnegan performed the following analysis of Bucks County.
If you click on it it gets big enough to see.
What you notice: you can damn near sort the table by percentage of bacholer’s degrees and you get the swing.
This is why so much of the analysis since the election has been sloppy. It looks on the surface that performance in the suburbs in Philly was OK. But when you look WITHIN the counties, you see enormous shifts you wouldn’t expect.
THIS IS NOT A RURAL PROBLEM. IT IS A PROBLEM WITH LOWER EDUCATED VOTERS. THE PROOF OF THIS IS YOU SEE SIMILAR SWINGS AMONG EDUCATION LEVELS IRREGARDLESS OF LOCATION.
And I will say this article is why we are where we are. The analysis needs to be much more careful. There is an emerging consensus that the single most important variable in white performance is education, not income.
SLOW DOWN. UNDERSTAND THE DATA.
If people are interested the people on twitter to follow who are actually trying to take the time to understand what happened follow these people:
@xenocryptsite
@kklondik
@EsotericCD
Harry Enten and Patrick Ruffiani are good too (the later is a Republican)
All age groups?
Don’t know. Patrick Ruffiani posted he could explain 81% of the variation – but he dumped about all the census data he could find into the spreadsheet.
This takes time. I have been asked to it for the counties around Tampa. You have to align the census data with the town data and then see if you can get to the precinct level.
But the devil is in the details. It DOES appear Trump outperformed relative to Romney in I-4 Hispanic precincts.
We really need to listen. Part of that listening is understanding in more than a superficial way what the data are telling use. Another is actually talking to the people who left Obama for Trump.
People are so safe in their cocoons. They think they know right now how to fix this.
But these same people, including the writer of this blog, were so confident about the result of this election.
So maybe some humility is in order.
There does need to be more distinction between rural, exurban and suburban.
In Florida, the true suburban/urban sections if I-4 voted for Clinton, but that can be disguised by treating counties as suburban that have a heavy exurban component.
I don’t feel like the counties between Orlando and Tampa really line up with the Philly suburbs very well for comparative purposes.
Philly’s ring counties are more diverse and have more urban components.
If you look at Philly’s outer suburbs (exurbs) like Berks County, for example, you see a better match. Western Chester County is that way, too, although the area keeps shrinking. My precinct has moved from exurban to suburban in its behavior in the ten years that I’ve lived here.
And, yes, education level is another thing that you can see on a granular level even in the suburbs, which is one reason why Clinton did much better in Mont. Co than she did in Bucks, and also why she didn’t do much better than treading water in Delaware Co.
Chester and Mont Cos. are comparatively highly educated which is why Trump bled Romney support.
What remains true in both Florida and PA is that Clinton got her votes where she wanted them and you can’t really blame apathy or low turnout for her loss. Turnout was down nationally, but Clinton do well where she focused her efforts.
Ignoring Wisconsin and Michigan look doubly bad for this reason. She could have gotten the votes she needed there.
In PA, I don’t think she could have done much better than she did in her strongholds, at least around Pittsburgh and Philly. She lost support in the Northeast, though, which was a contributor to her problems.
You might have forgotten that I desperately wanted Biden to run against her and only gave up hope of stopping her when he decided he just couldn’t do it.
The Northeast is one area where Biden definitely would have run much stronger.
Could the push for free college have helped drive this? To somebody that didn’t go to college, and doesn’t expect their children to, free college is going to sound like a huge subsidy to what they think is already a privileged group.
I don’t think so. Free college wasn’t a very big part of the messaging. And people who didn’t go to college certainly want their children to go.
But I don’t know.
All the way back to the early parts of the Republican primary Trump’s base had been ID’s as relatively well-off people without a college education. This is fairly strongly correlated with “old” which does make analysis difficult. I wonder how those townships break down by age – suburban development style does tend to produce large areas of relatively homogenous age.
That is really part of what needs to be understood better.
Good comment.
Some great stuff from Patrick Ruffini about Philly.
Trump closed the gap in black parts of Philly.
Examples:
Philly Ward 4:
2012
10353-58
2016
9152-117
Turnout Change: -13%
Margin Change: -1260
Similar trends in Wards 6, 11 and 12.
In those 4 wards there is nearly a 5K swing in margin from ’12.
Thesis: GOTV failure in Black part of Philly overcome by white portions in other parts of Philly. Trump did outperform Romney in percentage terms though that was probably to be expected. A larger margin was possible out of Philly.
This was the failure – if you weren’t going to try to stop the bleeding among WWC, you had to punish Trump in other places. Matching O’s margins in ’12 wasn’t enough.
GOTV dropoff in some inner city wards accounts for maybe 40% of the margin statewide.
NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT THIS YET!
It will be consigned to the memory hole in short order.
It will be the LEFT wing that failed the center, as always. See it posted right in this thread–the pouty left caused the midterm losses in 2010 and 2012. How many times have PEW numbers been posted here that show it was the youth and AA who did not show up? Makes no difference in the bible of the institution.
To be clear, that is just for PA. Rural AA? Cause I thought she made her numbers in the urban/suburban districts. Or maybe more cross-over Republicans in those areas concealed the drop there?
It seems to me the discussion of how the Democratic party recovers elides the essential point that with the appointment to the law enforcement and national security leadership of a group whose principles are apparently at odds with the basic tenets of liberal democracy the future may abruptly change course from predictions we are now comfortably making.
Some of us have been sounding the alarm for some time on this point; for the provisions of the PATRIOT Act and the practices exposed by the Snowden revelations to come under the essentially secret control of an empowered executive in an administration whose liberties with the norms of what we thought was our pluralistic and egalitarian society are already clearly apparent and no obvious legislative barriers to excess.
Brace yourselves. We will be the party of civil liberties and the rule of law first or there will be no after.
A worthwhile read:
A thoughtful interview with an authoritarian regime researcher from the Midwest.
Thanks for sharing this.
Just thinking out loud here after reading the linked article: what’s the appropriate course of action for people like yours truly who live in overwhelmingly blue/liberal communities? I’ve done volunteer work in the past with one community in the crosshairs (refugees), helping teach people basic life skills for surviving in the US, literacy tutoring, that sort of stuff. I want to re-engage that activity, but where ought my priorities be if we’re worried about crazy stuff like registries of Muslims?
THIS.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38026825
I think Schumer is on the team. This gives me hope.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/chuck-schumer-is-all-in-on-bernie-sanders-democratic-party_us_58
307a38e4b030997bbfc3cc
More on Schumer:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/20/us/politics/in-a-trump-era-schumer-declares-democrats-are-the-barr
ier.html
Just an idea: A sweeter deal for current and veteran military members and their families. Joining the armed services was the #1 choice of my graduating high school class in Ottawa County, OH. (The bellweather rural Ohio county that has swung the way of the winner for eons.)
It wasn’t a choice really: they couldn’t go to college.
Another idea: Address the obesity epidemic without fat shaming. Its killing a generation, 20 years before their time. (btw the answer isn’t fewer calories and more exercise. Eat meat!)
We also need to choose candidates that don’t insult uneducated white voters in private. Really hurt when Barack did it and I also think it was the deplorables comment that ultimately doomed Hillary. We’ve got serious cultural issues here. I still cringe when I hear urban white liberals talk about Pennsyltucky. They don’t have a f*ckin’ clue.
Bernie got it, and Hillary most certainly did not.
“Just an idea: A sweeter deal for current and veteran military members and their families. Joining the armed services was the #1 choice of my graduating high school class in Ottawa County, OH. (The bellweather rural Ohio county that has swung the way of the winner for eons.)”
Huh? Romney won 2012?
Candidate/Proposal Party Votes Percent
Mitt Romney REP 87,227 66.7%
Barack Obama DEM 41,704 31.9%
Party Votes Percent
Donald J. Trump REP 90,353 61.3%
Hillary Clinton DEM 46,298 31.4%
http://gis.co.ottawa.mi.us/ElectionResults/Election/Summary/NOV0612
Poke around this website and look at the benefits currently offered and see if you feel a sweeter deal is necessary or will have any effect, considering most of these benefits were championed by mostly Democrats like Jim Webb and Bobby Scott.
http://va.gov
“After earlier passing the House and Senate in different forms in May 2008 mainly with support from Democrats and a few Republicans, a bipartisan deal was brokered and the bill passed as an amendment to H.R. 2642, the FY08 Supplemental Appropriations Bill, commonly referred to as the War Funding Bill.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-9/11_Veterans_Educational_Assistance_Act_of_2008#Bill_opponents
Your idea about sweetening military benefits is problematic in other areas as well. It already skews more rural, white, conservative, and male than the U.S. population, giving them more benefits creates more division. Most, if not all, Southern states and many others give tax benefits to military veterans and their families. This creates an unseen boost to white families over families of color. It also leads to wealth inequality between males and females due to the limited opportunities for females from the same situation. These may be a relatively small boosts, but it adds to inequality. In addition, joining the military and serving in Southern military installations will most likely lead to recruits coming out more conservative when they leave as veterans.
We need to give people in rural areas more options, not sweeten the military package. I would like to have an American version of the Peace Corps that pays its staff. People that now feel like they only have the military as an option would have a choice and perhaps distressed areas in this country could feel like their government cares. If it was structured right, it could actually help communities revitalize or at least maintain an existing functioning infrastructure.
“Another idea: Address the obesity epidemic without fat shaming. Its killing a generation, 20 years before their time. (btw the answer isn’t fewer calories and more exercise. Eat meat!)”
Fat shaming is a real issue, but I don’t think it is one of the main factors in increasing obesity rates, although I could be mistaken. The impact of policies that promote cheap high fat and calorie foods that are unhealthy is most likely. Our over reliance on corn in our agricultural policy. Subsidizing our sugar and meat industries is also quite disastrous in trying to mitigate climate change and raise American health standards. Beef, pork, and chicken production are hard on the soil, water, and create unsustainable amounts of methane. The restaurant industry and unrestricted commercials are propaganda agents working to create an environment where gorging and unhealthy eating are considered the norm.
Why are you so bullish on meat? I hope you are not on an Atkins meat diet or some variation. I have seen numerous people on these meat diets over the years and the diets never work. It is about more calories burned than calories consumed, it really is that simple. It is science. There are no real tricks other than to get your metabolism running more efficiently by eating an hour or two after exercising. If you eat meat eat the fat, it fills you up and you don’t crave more food. If you use dairy products use whole milk and butter, don’t use low-fat milk nor margarine. The attempt at decreasing their fat content tricks your body into cravings.
“We also need to choose candidates that don’t insult uneducated white voters in private. Really hurt when Barack did it and I also think it was the deplorables comment that ultimately doomed Hillary. We’ve got serious cultural issues here. I still cringe when I hear urban white liberals talk about Pennsyltucky. They don’t have a f*ckin’ clue.”
Like this f***er?
“While Lyndon Baines Johnson was a man of time and place, he felt the bitter paradox of both. I was a young man on his staff in 1960 when he gave me a vivid account of that southern schizophrenia he understood and feared. We were in Tennessee. During the motorcade, he spotted some ugly racial epithets scrawled on signs. Late that night in the hotel, when the local dignitaries had finished the last bottles of bourbon and branch water and departed, he started talking about those signs. “I’ll tell you what’s at the bottom of it,” he said. “If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.” “
I am not as familiar with FDR’s private thoughts, but I’m sure the media could make a mountain out of these sensible statements.
“It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach.” -Franklin D. Roosevelt
“I am neither bitter nor cynical but I do wish there was less immaturity in political thinking.”-Franklin D. Roosevelt
The media strips away context and the audience. I thought the treatment of Mitt Romney’s 47% comment was a bit unfair as well. What Obama and Clinton said in those instances was roughly accurate when understanding they were trying to educate their audience about concerns with reaching certain voters. They both could have been more precise with their language in focusing on counterproductive or harmful behavior and not groups of people. However, how do you talk about the 30-50% of Trump’s supporters with beliefs that are considered racist and bigoted by the general public without going to an uncomfortable place? That’s why we tend to ignore it.
Welcome to the Booman Tribune!
http://www.co.ottawa.oh.us/OCBoardofElections/Archives/EL45.htm
Barack Obama/Joe Biden (DEM) . . . . 11,503 51.11
Mitt Romney/Paul Ryan (REP) . . . . 10,538 46.83
You were right about Ottawa County Ohio. Originally, I had the Michigan county and forgot to delete and fix it. My apologies for the mistake.
I’ve been on this site almost since day 1. This ain’t my first rodeo. I haven’t been posting here much because my outlook is just too bleak right now.
On meat: I understand science well enough, no need to be patronizing. (My astrophysicist husband tolerates me, a lowly-statician, well enough.) I have spent the last few years reading pubmed articles on nutrition. While I know that I am right on the science, the political idea is complete non-starter. I shouldn’t have tossed it out there.
Honestly, I’m not sure that there is a policy solution to our current situation.
I apologize, I just saw your 2 most recent posts in your history.
Not a big a fan of meat diets, but if it works for you more power. I quit eating lean meat and switched to eating fatter cuts. Quit drinking low fat milk and only drink whole. Quit the yogurt and margarine blends and went back to butter. I do not have the weight gain I was having before, and if I exercise a little above a moderate level, I tend to lose a few pounds here and there. I have dropped 10-15 lbs. the last 2 years since the switch, and I feel full when I eat.
In terms of health, I’m partial to body types having a little extra fat with moderate activity or exercise levels. They seem to have the longest life spans in most of the studies I have seen.
Quit drinking low fat milk and only drink whole. Quit the yogurt and margarine blends and went back to butter.
Good choices. The observational scientific data supports you.
My two cents:
I was 230 when I retired in 2002. (Pretty high for a short guy, 5′-7″)
This morning, 151, where I have been the past year or so. Below 160 for several years.
I first hit 230 in 1980. Between 1980 and 2002, fluctuations up and down between 190 and 230, maybe occasionally 180.
So:
Exercise works. There are a gazillion scientific studies on this, nearly all of which say exercise is useless. I disagree, the more access to activity I have, the better I control my weight. I currently ride my road bike about 3 hours a day, obviously not possible while I still worked.
CICO, calories in, calories out. The laws of Conservation of Energy and Conservation of Matter and Thermodynamics remain true. Calorie balance counts.
My experience is bulky foods like raw vegetables are good for appetite control. I do not find fatty foods satiating, they make it easy for me to overeat.
Nutritionally, fat soluble micronutrients are important as is omega three, so I do eat a lot of fatty fish, several eggs a day (the high omega three kind) and a couple of ounces of cheese. Other than that, I try hard to minimize other fats. (Fat makes me fat.)
I think it better to eat significantly more than the RDA of protein.
I amg oing to start a diary and put these same thoughts into it.
“The leaders, however, have to get this balance right…”
No chance; cannot happen. This prediction does not depend upon any assumptions about skill, or about grasp of the existential stakes, or about any level of integrity. It rests, like a rock, upon one thing only: the fact that the situation is completely unprecedented. Nobody gets anything right the first time — unless by luck, in which case, still, nothing would be learned.
“Now, there are a lot of ways in which the Democrats can go about competing better in these counties, and I welcome all suggestions. … candidate recruitment is an important factor. Policy … real concerns that the Democrats can take the lead on addressing. … opioid epidemic. … using anti-trust law to bring back small business ownership in rural America. … policies aimed at empowering people to learn the skills and get access to the capital to start small businesses. The promise isn’t to bring back the factories but to bring back the Mom and Pop hardware stores and banks and pharmacies.”
All good ideas.
There are signs that the Warren/Sanders wing will take the leadership of the party … if this happens there is hope. They need to emphasize the grass roots, energize and support the local Democratic party outreach in every corner of the country. They need to emphasize outreach to young people. They need to be super-alert to countering the endless streams of Republican propaganda, something the Clinton Democrats were amazingly bad at.
The aim, as you say, is not so much to convert died-in-the-wool Republicans, as to organize everyone else.
Remember, Sanders did well with Democrats in many of these rural areas. That is a good sign right there.
it’s highly unlikely that race was the primary determinant.
While Trump is full of racist leanings, rather think “Hope & Change” economically. Obama failed, failed, failed to deliver economically. Period. He gave us more wars, more bailouts to the rich. Plus, he wanted to drive various free-trade agreements down rust-belt throats. He’s an asshole, and Clinton was worse. The voters decided to play the Monty Hall game rationally, for once. Keep showing us donkeys, and we switch curtains, beeyotch! Unfortunately, the pussy-grabber happened to be behind the wrong curtain at the wrong time.
Now we’re all screwed, but we were anyway, so who cares?
It is over. Stick the friggin’ fork into it!
You live in a fantasy world. There isn’t an economic indicator that hasn’t significantly improved under Obama.
Not knocking Obama’s overall economic record, but there need to be adjustments in how the economic gains are distributed.
Labor force participation rate may be less cyclical than we think. Bill McBride at Calculated Risk has been making a case that the labor force participation’s decline was already under way before the Great Recession, and has to do with changes in demographic trends that are independent of economic cycles. You can read his short take here. He’s written quite a bit about it on his blog elsewhere as well. I’ve been recommending Calculated Risk for a number of years now. It helped me when I was trying to make sense of some troubling signs in the economy prior to the Great Recession, and has been generally on point during and since. For whatever it might be worth.
Thanks for the website suggestion.
I don’t think the participation rate is a great metric anymore due to the changes in males and females more comfortable in leaving the workforce compared to their parents. In addition, I think historically smaller family sizes throw off comparisons to the past. Lastly, I think the bulge of baby boomers staying in the workforce longer than expected due to the Great Recession also make it difficult to calculate.
I only used it because many on the Right use it as talking point. We need to be able to address it.
Things are better, but people tend to vote on an absolute level. In rural/exurban communities life is pretty hard for most people even if it’s better than 2009. I don’t have a connection to the Rust Belt communities, but the small city I come from in Alabama still has house prices below construction costs 9 years after the Great Recession started. Jobs are limited and my last childhood friend still living there moved out last year. I would expect people in those kinds of situations to vote for “change”.
In general there’s been a marked bifurcation in economic performance over Obama’s term. Metropolitan areas, both inner city and suburb, are doing pretty well in terms of jobs and income, with the main problem being high housing costs. Exurbs and rural areas have fallen behind – sometimes even when close to booming metropolitan areas. In spite of healthy growth and nutso housing costs in greater LA, some of the exurbs here like Lancaster and Victorville are still doing rather poorly.