The Dems are going to reform the party?
Not if this kind of shit continues:
New questions complicate Ellison’s bid for DNC chair
Opponents of Rep. Keith Ellison’s bid to be the next Democratic National Committee chairman are raising new questions about the Minnesota Democrat’s past to make the case that he’s unfit to be the party’s next leader.
Ellison’s critics in the DNC and some supporters of Labor secretary Tom Perez, the other top candidate, are pointing to the Minnesota Democrat’s past tax troubles, campaign finance violations and minor legal issues that once led to his driver’s license being suspended as evidence that he’s ill-equipped to lead the DNC.
Some of those instances date back to the 1990s. All of the issues have been rectified and were previously used in attacks against Ellison during his first run for House in 2006.
That year, Ellison’s then-wife, Kim Ellison, who acted as his campaign treasurer, wrote to the Minneapolis Star Tribune to accept responsibility for all of the violations.
At the time, Kim Ellison said that memory loss associated with her multiple sclerosis was the reason for the unpaid traffic tickets, late campaign finance reports, and household bookkeeping errors.
But Ellison’s detractors within the DNC say that it’s evidence he can’t manage his personal life and would be a poor choice to manage an institution the size of the DNC.
Bob Mulholland, a DNC member from California and one of 447 who will vote in the February election, says he has not backed a candidate yet but will not support Ellison.
“One Republican said to me, `You’re going to elect a tax cheat who drives without a license?'” Mulholland said. “It’s absurd.”
“If Ellison were running as a Republican, Democrats would attack him as a tax cheat, so I have no idea why Washington insiders are urging the grassroots to elect another insider. If you can’t drive or pay taxes, you can’t organize your life, so I concluded early on that he can’t organize for this job.”
Ellison’s past incursions with campaign finance laws and the IRS have been public information for some time, but most DNC members reached by The Hill said they were hearing about it for the first time.
Ellison’s supporters are furious, and accusing his opponents of running a smear campaign against him, which they say started with accusations that Ellison is an anti-Semite.
The Minnesota Democrat has been dealing with blowback over his support as a young man for the Nation of Islam, which he has since rejected, and past comments about U.S. foreign policy being beholden to Israel.
“This is the same bullshit as people pulling up his past comments to try and paint him as an anti-Semite,” said Minnesota Democratic chairman Ken Martin, an Ellison supporter who also has a vote in the DNC race.
Martin points to Ellison’s Jewish supporters–including campaign chairman and former ambassador to Morocco Sam Kaplan–as proof that the anti-Semite accusations are “complete bullshit.”“His opponents are looking through his past and digging up stuff from his Congressional and legislative races that fell flat and that Minnesotans rejected,” Martin said. “I welcome them to keep focusing on stuff that doesn’t matter. Keith will focus on building the party up from the grassroots.”
—snip—
DemRat business as usual, seems to me. Just like it’s been since at least 2002.
Following is what Keith Ellison and Bernie Sanders have to say about a party that has now almost completely discredited itself by throwing a “sure thing” election (and possible control of Congress and the Supreme Court) to a crude, amateur, anti-establishment hustler.
Read on.
New questions complicate Ellison’s bid for DNC chair
On December 14, the political advocacy group Our Revolution hosted a livestream event with Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) and Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.) discussing the need to reform the Democratic Party. Both Sanders and Our Revolution have endorsed Ellison in his campaign to be the next chair of the Democratic National Committee (DNC). What follows is an abridged transcript of their remarks, edited for length and clarity.
Bernie: What we are doing tonight is not sexy, and it’s not going to make the headlines in the newspapers all over the country, but it is unprecedented for the Democratic Party and for the long-term future of our country, and it is of enormous consequence. At a time of low voter turnout, at a time when millions of Americans are demoralized politically and are sick and tired of establishment politics and establishment economics, we are gathered here tonight not only in this building but all over America to begin the process of transforming American politics and of creating a government which works for all of the people–not just the 1%.
That is what we are here to do, and in order to make that happen our first step is to transform the Democratic Party from a top-down party to a bottom-up body, to create a grassroots organization of the working families of this country, the young people of this country. I will tell you, having been all over this great nation of ours, there is an incredible idealism of millions of young people who believe in this country and who love this country and are prepared to fight to make this country all that we can become. I want to also urge all Americans regardless of income, regardless of their race, their nationality, their sexual orientation, to jump into the political process and make the Democratic Party a democratic party with a small “d,” not just a capital “d.”
—snip—
The painful truth is that despite President Obama’s strong victories in 2008 and 2012, the Democratic Party has lost enormous political ground over the last eight years. The Republicans have just won the White House. The Republicans now control the Senate. The Republicans now control the House. Republican governors now control almost two-thirds of the statehouses in this country, and over the last eight years Democrats have lost some 900 legislative seats from one end of America to the other. That is the simple, indisputable truth. Clearly, whatever the leadership of the Democratic Party has been doing over the last few years has failed, and we need fundamental change.
—snip—
Brothers and sisters, the status quo is not working, and we will not succeed if we continue along the same old path. Now is the time for real change in the Democratic Party, now is the time to revitalize the Democratic Party and bring in people who have not been welcomed in the past. We should not be afraid of new energy and new faces; we should welcome and embrace new energy and new faces. Now is the time for a chair of the Democratic Party who has a very different vision of the party then those who are in control today. Now is the time for Keith Ellison to become chair of the Democratic Party.
As I know many of you are aware, Keith is currently the co-chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, and has been one of the leading progressive voices on all of the major issues facing the middle class and working families of our country. He has been there on picket lines. He’s been up front and out front in terms of workers’ rights, in terms of the environment and climate change, in terms of the need to create a healthcare system that guarantees healthcare to all people as a right. He has been out in front on women’s rights, on the rights of the LGBT community, on the need for real criminal justice reform, on the need for immigration reform and on the need for real tax reform, so that Donald Trump and the other billionaires start paying their fair share of taxes. For many, many years Keith has been there not as a follower, but as a leader. Unlike some of the other candidates running for chair, Keith knew from day one that the TPP was a disaster for working families and helped us defeat the TPP. Keith is by nature a grassroots organizer–that is what he does and that is who he is. He is not a creature of the inside-the-beltway world; he is a person who lives in the real world, feels comfortable in the real world, and is going to bring the real world into the Democratic Party.
—snip—
Brothers and sisters, we are in a perilous and momentous moment in American history. You all know that, and we are going to need a political party that has the guts to stand with working families, has the guts to take on the big money interests that control to a large degree our economic and political life.
It is my great privilege to introduce to you someone who I believe is going to be the next chair of the Democratic National Committee. Please welcome congressman Keith Ellison.
Keith: If there was ever a moment when people who love this country and the people in it need to step up and do everything they can to improve the lives of their fellow Americans, that moment is right now.
If I told you that you had an opportunity to fight for people who felt vulnerable and scared in this Trump America, would you do it? If I told you that you had a chance to stand up and fight for working people, would you do it? If I told you that you could be the hero of folks who pour the cement, who teach the classes, who take care of the folks in the hospital, who take care of the children, who cook the food–I mean the hard-working people of America–would you step up and do something for them?
Well that’s good, because we need you to do all of that right now. Because let me tell you, it’s hard to imagine somebody like Donald Trump being elected president, but in a few days he will be the president. I don’t know what stage in the whole spectrum of grief you may be at, but I think we need to arrive at acceptance that he’s about to be the president. And that means that each of us and all of us have to do every single thing that we can to protect our fellow Americans and to advance the cause of economic and social justice. This is a historic moment, this is a movement moment and this moment may well be the moment when the American people thought to reclaim their democracy of, by and for the people.
—snip—
This is what we got to do: Right now we got to reset the future of the Democratic Party. We got to reset the Democratic party on the basis of grassroots activism. We got to reset the Democratic Party on the basis of working people who are striving every single day to make a better life for themselves and their families right here in America. I’m talking about African Americans, white Americans, Latino Americans, Native Americans. I’m talking about Asian Americans, about people who are Jewish and Muslim and Christian and Buddhist and Hindu and those who have no faith at all. I’m talking about folks like you and me, folks like us that need to say that the Democratic Party has got to be democratic, and it starts with getting some leadership in there that’s going to fight for that democracy. I’m telling you right now, this is the moment we have been waiting for: The time for us to stand up and fight back and reclaim our nation. Y’all ready?
—snip—
Here’s the other thing, there’s a lot of folks who voted for Trump. Don’t reject them; ask them what are you thinking about? How do you feel now? Are you willing to work with us? Now did he disappoint you or do you still feel satisfied? Because there’s a whole lot of folks after they lose their healthcare, they are going to be a little bit annoyed. Don’t push them away, bring them in.
And the last thing I want to ask you to do is just understand that there’s a lot of folks who might have their family roots south of the border, and a guy who just got elected said, “Build a wall.” These people need our support. These are our brothers and sisters, and we can’t let them feel vulnerable and afraid. A dear friend of mine said to me recently that she was called to a meeting with her friend. She brought her little five-year-old daughter with her. And she said to my friend, if me and my husband are picked up and deported, you know Juanita is born in America, she’s a citizen: Would you take care of her? You understand? Think about having that conversation. That’s real for a lot of people. There are other people who were told that they were going to be banned from immigrating here based on their religion. People who are Muslim, be a friend. People who are gay and lesbian, people who are Jewish–a lot of anti-Semitism has really popped up. You got to stand with everybody who is feeling vulnerable right now. Because one of the things Trump has uncorked is that hate machine, and we have got to resist it and stand up against it. Our best weapon against it is our own solidarity. Let’s remake the Democratic Party, everybody.
It’s been a long time since I have heard anybody in even a possible position of power in the Democratic Party say things like this. Since RFK, really. And…as usual…the old guard is trying to use the same sort of old politics smearing to make sure they don’t lose control of the Democratic Party money machine.
If those people succeed, we are back in Humphrey territory once again.
Make your voices heard,
Throw the bums out!!!
AG
Like I said:
If this does not happen?
If old politics botoxes its way back into power?
Then we need a new party.
And fast!!!
AG
…just a little…
Forgive me, please. I simply cannot resist the following little vignette that illustrates the current totally fucked-up state of current U.S. governmental bureaucracy.
There you have it in a nutshell, up and down the system.
Substitute the FEC, the FDA, the RNC and DNC, the SEC, the FBI, the CIA…any and all three-letter agencies…in place of this little local fuckup and the transition would be seamless.
Take the SEC…the Securities and Exchange Commission.
Seamless.
Throw the Bums Out!!!
AG
It’s a case of pure optics. I can’t think of anything more to cement Republican domination than to select a Black Muslim as the public face of the Democratic Party. Yes, I know he quit. But he’s black and a Muslim. This is the kind of fine distinction that elites make that go WAY over the heads of the voters.
I’ve heard lots of good things about him from people whose opinion I respect. It’s not fair to hold him back because of race and religion. Still, this will be red meat for the Republicans. Especially after more Muslim terrorism in Europe.
You remember how lots of people said that treating “everything as a class issue” signaled to them that brown people were expendable? Your comment here only cements that viewpoint. You say you don’t like identity politics but what you’re advocating is simply white identity politics. These are similar arguments I’m seeing from Clinton people so it’s kind of funny to see you on the same side of that. The goal should not be to cede ground to a right wing frame but organize and educate about why it’s wrong.
Watch Reverand Barber talk about HB2 today, how he tries to educate beyond the sound bites of a “bathroom bill”. This man is the soul of a political movement in NC, he’s why they even can have power to potentially repeal it. Without racist gerrymandering they’d be passing protections bills, not just repealing attacks. This man is organizing the south, and we should look to his leadership:
link
Didn’t say it was right. In fact, I’ll say definitely that it’s wrong.
But it’s marketing.
A black spokesman is OK, but a Muslim? Even a white Muslim will lose more votes. Black Muslim will hurt with the old. Muslim will hurt with everyone that fears terrorists.
I mean I know what you’re saying, but that’s just asking us to throw them under the bus for political expediency. Also an argument that was used in defense of things like Jim Crow: “I’m not racist, but my customers are, so…”
under the bus for political expediency
is a political reality in this country. One reason why our politics are so ugly and dirty. The Clintons are repeat offenders. And who did Obama throw under the bus after his ’08 win? Republicans are more clever when doing this and also get help from religious institutions and rightwing media that covers up the tosses under the bus.
I agree it’s a political reality — it’s why Joe Manchin will do what he does. I think there are ways to do it that’s better than what Manchin is doing, but I understand it.
Speaking of worse than useless, the NC Democrats just got played with HB2 repeal. Charlotte’s initial repeal was contingent on HB2 repeal, but the GOP asked them to remove that clause — they did. Now GOP ends special session and didn’t repeal it. Worthless. Absolutely worthless. Charlotte better pass the ordinance again.
It comes down to “Do you want to be right? Or do you want to win?”
An ethical question that I have no answer to. Sometimes door #1, sometimes door #2.
Door #3.
I want to be right and win!!!
AG
Ah my friend, life has taught me that you can never have it all.
Could be.
Ya gotta believe, though.
All teams win the World Series once…
AG
Both. Or as near to both as possible in the short run. Longer term, might require breaking a few eggs in the near term, but should be carefully be considered and must include all the longer term potential negative ramifications in that egg breaking.
For example, LBJ broke a lot of eggs with civil rights legislation and understood that near term consequences for his political party, but he expected Democratic politicians that came after him to be capable of effectively managing it in the longer-term and on balance the a “go-slow” option had just as many downsides and far few upsides. What he didn’t anticipate was that Democratic politicians would regress to their pre-FDR suckitude.
OTOH, the go-slow option at the state level on reproductive rights and get that ERA ratified had more medium and longer term upsides and fewer downsides than appealing to the SC.
While I hear what you’re saying about Ellison, I’m not hearing other options. Perez is a no go as far as I’m concerned. We’ve already gone down that path and it was only a short-term fix without lasting value. So, the left party is now in more of a shambles and with less power than it was in ’04.
Yeah. The debacle of the overtime regulations that he arranged killed my opinion of his abilities. No one will ever see a cent. But I see the cheerleaders are still counting that as a win.
heh — they’re counting proposals that went nowhere as wins. Resume padding. (Just like a certain person has done for a few decades.)
They need a Johnson – a back alley fighter that never heard of the Marquis of Queensbury. Background none too clean, but knows where the bodies are buried and how to use that knowledge. Where he tripped up was Vietnam. He was tripped up his Texas fighting instincts and his reverence for the intellectual abilities of those Ivy League pukes who knew nothing and understood less about the real world.
Okay. But LBJ is dead. Any nominations for someone like him? All that seems to be around these days are Ivy League pukes who knew nothing and understood less about the real world.
E. Warren is scrappy but she’s a product of good public colleges. And came up the hard way — through her own work and found a niche that’s she’s passionate about. But she’s needed where she is.
The job requires organizational and management skills, clear and strong political orientation away from the oligarchs (that was a shortcoming of Dean; one that was known but strategically and tactically he had something to offer while the others had nothing), and public speaking and presentation abilities (mostly TV and radio) (that was also another shortcoming of Dean).
This sort of talent should be incubated in state Democratic parties, but that’s not happening. Maybe I should take another look at the list of Berniecrats that ran for office.
Elizabeth Warren?
She’s the best we have so far, short of Bernie…who really is too old to be much more than an inspiration for the future now.
She appewrs to have “organizational and management skills,” “a clear and strong political orientation away from the oligarchs” and “public speaking and presentation abilities.”
Where’s the beef?
AG
DNC Chair is a full time job. Pulling Warren out of the Senate would leave Schumer fully in control of financial services oversight and we know who he answers to.
Also, the Governor of MA is a Republican who will name a temporary fill-in for the seat and I’m none too confident that the MA voters wouldn’t elect Scott Brown a second time or the current governor wouldn’t run and win the seat.
Someone younger that can last for at least eight years and who’s appointed wouldn’t jeopardize losing a major chunk of what little current liberal power currently exists.
I was not speaking of Warren as DNC chair; I was speaking of her as the public face of the Democratic Party.
AG
Okay. But that requires that she have a formal role in the party as a leader for her to be accepted as such by the media that gives time to political party leaders. Those roles are the top two in the Senate and House for the majority party and top one and occasionally the whip for the minority party, party chair (and sometimes the vice), and administration officials. The media also invites various members of congress to appear, but they are speaking from the position of their office and not the party. Fmr POTUS and VP nominees get more frequent invitations than other members of congress.
Warren isn’t the ranking member of any committee she sits on and is only one of three vice-chairs on Democratic Policy and Communications Center. The party wants Warren out there because she makes a positive impression, but for now Schumer and Pelosi are the face of the Democratic Party and the next DNC chair will join them.
YIOu rited:
If so?
See the title of my post.
If there is one thing that we should have learned from Trump’s success, it is this:
Thed old rules no longer apply.
Not learned?
Time for a new party that works on the new rules,
ASG
What’s with Mass.? People are shocked at the Midwest going (R). I’m shocked at Mass.
Not at all uncommon for MA to elect a GOP governor. Think of it as a counterweight to its legislature. So, wouldn’t read too much into electing their latest GOP governor. (Other than that they don’t much like Martha Coakley. She’s somewhat like Lundergan Grimes in KY in that voters don’t dislike either of them, but not wild enough about either to elect as a governor or senator (at least so far).
Another win:
Ayman Mohyeldin
Some might view that as entirely appropriate for a Nobel Peace Prize winner.
What is he supposed to do when a judge arbitrarily says this standard isn’t good enough when said standard is accepted previously?
taken from Jared Bernstein’ blog.
Obama had 8 yrs. Perez had 4 yrs. But could only arrange to have implementation time fall in Dec. 2016?
If they had started earlier, would have had time to appeal or the Texas judge (one that Obama appointed, I think I read) would not have bothered because he was so reversable.
In fact, I read that the Lame Duck would have killed it even without his interference.
Oh, well….wonder how many Independents that bit of slight of hand created?
Yawn. You just complained it wasn’t written to stand scrutiny in court which implies the rule was written poorly. Now you’re moving goal posts of why’d it take so long?
No. You misread my comment. I think the regs were fine. I think the judge’s decision was in error and would have been overturned.
But indeed, my first goalposts were…why the fuck did it take so long to do it? It would have actually encouraged new hires when employment was falling off a cliff!
I suspect that many Latinos and African-Americans also fear terrorism. Ellison could overcome this in the time-honored fashion – being super-patriotic, doubling down on more government surveillance, more drone attacks, more Middle East intervention.
Off-topic: Has anyone considered that some of these terrorists assassinated by drone may simply be political or family enemies of our “allied” oil interests? Or simply the oil companies themselves. Recall that many, if not most, of the prisoners at Gitmo were innocents turned in by their neighbors and personal enemies for the $2000 reward? During Vietnam the Pentagon wanted body counts so every step along the way numbers were inflated. Some times a patrol fired randomly into the bush and reported Viet Cong kills. Marie3’s recent diary points out how the victims at My Lai were reported as “enemy soldiers” in the body count.
Give them the red meat!!!
Force them to eat it.
If it’s good red meat, let them choke on it.
They’re not used to good meat, Voice.
They’re McDonald’s eaters.
It’ll scare ’em to death.
We cannot any longer afford to run from these people. We cannot continue to produce “compromise” (Read: shadow-right) candidates like HRC. Are the racial and cultural demographics of this country not changing rapidly away from those of the Republican Party? Let’s get on that bus and go full throttle into the future in which we believe. If this multi-cultural. multi-ethnic American Dream is doomed because it simply will not work, let us find out. Let us find out the hard way, by trying to establish it, not by the soft, compromising ways that have finally this year…without the possibility of even shadow of a doubt…been proven to fail by a strong-but-oh so wrong opposition candidate.
I’m through piddling around with shadow centrist leftiness bullshit, myself. It is weak like a motherfucker!!! Stupid, cowardly and weak.
Strong-but-wrong seems to be winning all over the world now. Hate-wrong. Murder-wrong. Power=wrong.
How about some strong-but-right for a change!!!???
If not the ems, then another party.
The People’s Party!!!
It failed in the late 1800s…the wrong “peoples,” I think.
Now?
Now we’ve got a lot more different kinds of of “peoples.”
I didn’t know it at the time I started to become a musician, but my whole life has been about the successful fusion of cultures here in the U.S….and later, worldwide.
Jazz, blues and other, related musics rose from being ethnic specialities to the music of all of the Americas and to a great degree…about 100 years since their inception in New Orleans… the music of the whole world. And what was “:jazz?” It was the initial fusion of African and European musical techniques and culture. Without that fusion? No country, no pop, no rock, no hip-hop, no nuthin’!!!
Just this:
WE swung the Nazis out of power during WW II.
We can do it here, too.
Put it in their faces and dare them to dance.
Please.
Later…
AG
“They’re McDonald’s eaters.” Oh, yes!
Never knew that about the Nazis and music. Yeah, they were control freaks.
“Pragmatism” is the Achilles heel of almost all of those who self-identify as left of center. It’s only an okay position when the opposition has a strong sense of playing fair. That doesn’t exist today within the GOP or those in control of the Dem party. In this instance, pulling back gains nothing and reinforces the assumed weakness of the left among Democrats.
OTOH, lefties don’t often exhibit skill at pulling their punches. Too often going with and expending effort on not the best choice (hence Hackett in the ’06 OH Senate primary race and Lamont in CT). In part because of the limited available talent and not enough consideration of what could be available. I don’t know if Ellison is the best choice, but the key objective this time around has to be to diminish the stranglehold the Clinton faction (for lack of a better descriptive) has on the party. If the GOP can operate effectively with their “duh” Gillespie and Priebus faces, Ellison’s face is fine.
Just a reminder. Hillary Clinton was the most “pragmatic” Democratic candidate.
Donald Trump was the most “extreme” candidate.
Hillary Clinton failed to campaign for the electoral college in the Rust Belt.
Trump campaigned where Clinton assumed she was too strong to have to campaign but wasn’t.
Need we revisit the “pragmatism” of not passing a single payer healthcare bill because of the pragmatists in the Democratic caucus?
Hillary Clinton failed to campaign for the electoral college in the Rust Belt.
What did she have to sell there?
If Trump used any metrics to guide his campaign, it was no more than a focus on all ’12 blue states that Obama had carried by less than 10% and double-down on the states that Mitt carried by less than 10%. In the latter category that was AZ, GA, and NC.
In the former, he seemed mindful of the recent results in federal and state elections. That could have been why MN didn’t get much attention. IA and OH flipped so early that they didn’t need more attention. That left him with a mix of “swingy” and non-swingy states based on ’96-’12 results.
Not-swingy:
MI, PA, WI
One swing:
VA (’08)
Two swings
NV (’04 and ’08)
NH (’00 and ’04)
IA (’04 and ’08)
OH (’00 and ’08)
Four swings:
CO (’96, ’00, ’04, ’08)
FL (’96, ’00, ’04, ’08)
Had he had number crunchers (or Clinton’s Ada) directing his campaign, he would have spent a lot more time in CO, NH, and VA and less time in MI and WI. Instead he read his crowds. Let VA go early. NH wasn’t cost effective for him to fight for and with IA and OH sealed, he only have to concentrate on AZ, CO, FL, MI, NV, NC, PA, WI. In the last four weeks, the list was down to five or six (depending on whether he was doing a head fake in NV or thought his chances remained good there). The only deviation was ME2; possibly for sport.
Meanwhile, Clinton and her surrogates were fighting in states that had been decided — AZ, CO, NV, NH, OH, and VA. Along with those where she was behind FL and NC. And her Brooklyn team sent SEIU volunteers to IA instead of where they thought they were needed in MI as a head fake to trip up Trump.
Clinton also relied more on surrogates for campaign rallies: Bill and Chelsea and closer to the finish line, the Obamas. None of whom could be relied upon for accurate feedback to the campaign. I’ll probably never be convinced that her schedule was strictly based on strategy. But perhaps if her heavy fundraising schedule during the last two months is factored in, there may not have been much difference between her and Trump’s campaign appearance schedules. But while Trump was rallying voters in MI and WI, she was hanging with celebrities in NY and CA and basking in their attention and devotion.
This is pretty interesting. As I can only speak to my experiences in Va., beside execrable Liberty Un., crowds for Trump would have been small outside Northern Va, which was Hillary country; as most of the populations would have been small. While close in most of the state, NoVa sealed the deal for HRC and they were smart not to contend for it.
I don’t know Trump’s schedule but I seem to remember him doing events in smaller towns in Wis, Mich, and other points. All areas that helped win those states.
R
Thoroughly reviewing the campaign schedules, venues, attendance, and surrogates used would be a worthy project. Takes it from impressions based on news reports to real information. Should also include info on the media present for these appearances and if there were any local TV, radio, and newspapers in the locale.
Unless the national campaign coverage was highly distorted, we do know that Trump drew large crowds in many locations and Clinton didn’t. But those would have been urban locales. Don’t know that he squandered time after the primaries on rallies like the one Dave Eggers reported. Approximately 1,200 people at a Sacramento rally is pathetic. Although airport rallies wouldn’t be expected to draw yuuge crowds and the GOP nomination had been decided before the CA primary. (Bernie’s May 9, 2016 Sacramento rally Venue described as “packed.”)
However, would guess that most of his rallies were more like this one than large venue rallies. With him swooping in on his plane and spending an hour or less on the ground. He clearly had teams organizing these appearances. With an hour between his whistlestops, he could easily have held four to six rallies a day.
Tom Perez throws elbows, don’t he?
“Labor Secretary Tom Perez, who has spent a considerable amount of time boosting Hillary Clinton’s campaign, offered advice in February on how to change the narrative so people of color were discouraged from supporting Bernie Sanders.
The advice was sent in an email to Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta, which was published as part of a third batch of emails released by WikiLeaks.”
http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/10/11/labor-secretary-advised-clinton-cast-sanders-candidate-
whites-turn-minorities
Nah! It’s fake news! The Russians did it! /snark
Perez and Ellison are both good men and would represent an improvement over the execrable DWS. Who ever wins needs to restart the 50 state strategy, ASAP. It’d also be cool if Bernie would join the party.
I’m kinda new here, could the op please explain why he gave me a troll rating.
No reason. Just butt hurt. Uprated to counter.
Bullshit. Read my comment below.
AG
I read you comment below and your troll rating is still BS. People disagreeing with you does not make them a troll.
I’m not even sure where the disagreement lie. Unless it’s with the rather obvious statement that Tom Perez is a good man.
Can’t believe that I rec’d you. But when you’re right, you’re right.
Strange that my rec disappeared. re-instating it.
I explain below.
AG
I believe…on the evidence of your many posts… that you are a centrist Dem troll, MaureenDowdsLudes…or at the very least least someone who has been totally misled by other Dem trolling. I also think that everyone who cares even a little bit about true progressive ideas and ideals should read the following link very, very carefully, and then equally carefully consider what has been going on here for the better part of a year…the same thing that went on at dKos years ago.
Centrist Dem/PermaGov Dem trolling on a so-called “progressive” website.
Back in the early dKos days I used timeline analysis to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that there were troll cells operating there under a single name. There were too many posts for one human to write over many hours with no appreciable time to even go take a piss, and the posts were all attack posts on people who were espousing real leftist ideas.
Soon after, I was banned.
So it goes.
As I said in a comment here today:
“I’m through piddling around with shadow centrist leftiness bullshit, myself. It is weak like a motherfucker!!! Stupid, cowardly and weak.”
What I believe about the Republicans I also believe about quondam Democrats who maintain the name but support people like Tom Perez, who as mino so accurately posted here:
If I am banned for calling a spade a spade, so be it. The same concept that applies to the old-line centrist parties applies here. No more pulled punches. It’s too late for polite sparring. I am going to supply red meat. Red meat truth. If doing so means being drummed out of the PermaGov Democratic party…and/or its allied media…so be it.
Time to start a new party?
Maybe time to start a new media, too.
Later…
AG
Ha! Centrist Dem Troll. My new band name.
You could name your first album “Ron Paul, Enabler of Corporate and Slave Power”.
How about an album called “The Chuck Schumer Story”? That’d go over big in some circles!!! Hell, MaureenDowdsLudes might even get a White House gig.
AG
P.S. MaureenDowdsLudes. What an AWFUL handle!!!
I was going to go with “self aggrandizing asshole” but there was already one of those here.
Actually, an uncountable number.
“Centrist Dem Troll presents MaureenDowdsLudes Sings Songs of Nonprotest.”
Run wid it!!!
The direction this culture is headed, you might just have a hit.
AG
AG — let’s not play the troll ratings abusers game. Let’s be more cautious and not jump to conclusions when the evidence is scanty and be tolerant enough to recognize there will be differences among those to the left of the DNC/Clinton faction. Not saying your assessment is right or wrong in this case; only that dishing out troll ratings is petty and demonstrate lack of confidence that that real trolls won’t be properly addressed by this community.
heh — the troll ratings abusers believe, or claim to believe, that I’m a Republican. Don’t know if they’re so out to lunch that they can’t discriminate between a socialist and a free market capitalist or they’re centrist-Dem operatives. Doesn’t matter as either way they’re racking up a record of being wrong and soon enough will lose all credibility.
In the spirit of the season (yeah, I know it’s mostly consumer bs, but the spirit is still positive), why not withdraw this one troll rating?
Sure. Just as soon as the other 5 or 6 troll raters withdraw theirs on you, me, Oui and a few others.
I am through fucking around, Marie. Spades will be called spades from now on.
They aren’t going to change and Martin seems not to mind their trashing of the place.
However, why stoop to behaving like the puny punks and thugs? It only encourages them because that reveals skin as thin as theirs.
Let’s get real. Don’t sweat the small stuff.
My continued presence here speaks the the thickness of my own skin, Marie.
I stay because I care.
AG
Sometimes even you too need to listen to others. Your support in this instance of using a troll rating is zero among those that you generally or often agree with. Fine to discount the opinion of those that rarely or never agree with you. But your fellow travelers? That doesn’t speak well of following your own advice.
I rate because I care as well.
I would say that during the past…what, 10 years or more…I have spent almost zero time paying attention to ratings. I didn’t even really know how they worked until several months. Until ratings “trolls” (Please…anyone who has a better, less upsetting term please weigh in.) started downrating almost everything I wrote.
I asked for help. From Booman, from others here…and got some. Including a veiled warning from Booman that I had an overall rating level that was fairly low considering my length of time here and the generally positive contributions that I have made over the years.
Meanwhile, the downraters contributed little or nothing except short, complaining squibs…if that …and low ratings.
And now…??? Now we have the Trump nightmare the predictions of which those downraters refused to recognize.
I’m through playing footsie, Marie.
Through.
Like dat.
Sorry…
They want war?
OK.
Here I am.
Come get me.
AG
I’ll keep the rating. A badge of honor if you will. Gotta admit, it’s kind of rich getting a troll rating from a person who cracks on someones avatar.
Maybe I was wrong to give you the benefit of doubt. Why enter a diary thread when you have already decided that the diarist isn’t your cup of tea? Only those spoiling for a fight do that.
Yup.
As I said…
AG
I get the feeling that the concept of troll has been badly twisted by AG. A troll is someone who feeds off attention and will make outrageous statements in order to get said attention. You do not make outrageous statements and call attention to yourself or slander others, and so on. Now we could look at posters who (cough cough) do go out of their way to say outlandish things for the sake of controversy, who do insult on a regular basis and so on, and judge accordingly.
“Troll” has many meanings.
Its initial, historical two are as follows. (from Google definitions):
Contemporary internet usage seems to include elements of both definitions.
I do not know where to find an official definition of “troll” to include people…or bots, because we have absolutely no idea how far this “bot” thing has really gone… that persistently post things on a given site that are clearly meant to pull that site off of its general course. Like hijacking a thread, only using much longer lines. This can be of their own desire and/or because they were hired to do so.
My own usage-based understanding over about 15 years of blogging is that “troll” is a perfectly fine word to apply to these people, and I will continue to use it until someone proposes a better one. I watched them do it on dKos…with the willing cooperation of its owner, in my opinion…and now I am seeing the same system at work here. Does Booman countenance these people? If so, why? If not? Again, why no action? I dunno, myself. His own stated positions have moved way towards the center since I first came here.
That shackled frog logo on this site? That was supposed to be the war criminals of the Bush II era, headed for their respective punishments.
Now?
Only Republican war criminals deserve punishment?
Could be…
So it goes.
I don’t think so, myself.
AG
We have had posters who seem content to post clickbait with the express purpose of depressing enthusiasm for voting Democratic this year, a number of whom engaged in troll rating abuse as well. Several of those disappeared miraculously once Comrade Donny became the EC victor. Their work was done, I suppose. Russian or Russian paid bots? GOP stooges? I go back to my rather straightforward assessment – is the individual in question typically hijacking threads with little to add to in the way of content? Is the individual consistently engaged primarily in attention seeking and little else? Is the person consistently abusive to others on the site? If the yeses keep adding up, I’ll write the individual off as a troll and will do what I can to avoid engagement as much as possible – the one-off reply notwithstanding.
Me too.
Thank you.
AG
Are you sure about that and your impression wasn’t distorted by your advocacy because I never saw any of that. Although in the last few weeks before the election I didn’t often wander into the daily “Trump sucks” and “clap louder for Hillary” diary threads because they bored me. And while I can recall one or two strident Hillary supporters that have since gone silent, I can’t come up with a single “not with HER” that’s now MIA. While call outs by name are generally bad form that convention need not be adhered to when discussing MIA suspected trolls.
Uprated to counter unfair troll rating.
Headline from a post of Booman’s today:
Dem Senators Playing Footsie With Trump
Well…DUH!!!
Quel surprise!!!
It’s about two bumpkin Dem Senators playing old politics to try to keep their seats on the money/power/DC revolving door gravy train we laughingly call “The U.S. Senate.”
Go read it if you haven’t already.
Meanwhile…here’s where the real action lies. And I do mean “lies.” And this only a few days after the election!!!
Light on his feet, this Schumer guy.
Ain’t he.
It’s much easier to dance when you’re not carrying much moral baggage, I guess.
I personally would like to see a Democratic Party where people like Schumer and Pelosi would be forced to change parties in order to run for office.
I can already hear the scandalized centrist Dem cries of “Oh!!! Oh!!! We wouldn’t win elections like that!!!”
I got news fer y’all.
You can’t lose much more than you just did, sweethearts.
Get over it.
The center?
Here in corporate-owned America.
It leans way right!!!
Bet on it.
AG
I’ve been trying to tell people not to stigmatize or denigrate Trump voters. The approved talking points going around from specific agent provocateurs in various “progressive sites” is “racist, misogynist, ignorant” and throw in “religious gun nuts” for added flavor.
But these are Americans, and just as American as all the other sliced and diced members of the electorate HRC’s team tried to appeal to. They have to be engaged and listened to. At least elements within the Dem Party begin to recognize it.
But if one’s goal is to serve one’s constituency and try to better their lives, you can’t just reject everything coming out of the Trump White House out of hand. If it will have a positive effect on your State’s or district’s lives, you need to get behind it. Stand there with the cardboard check and crow how it was only possible through your Congressional work and influence. That is the only way to keep your seat and be there to fight the big fight another day. Big fights are coming.
I always faulted Obama for not making those in Congress who automatically opposed him suffer. They skated time and again. LBJ would have drank their blood in the Oval Office from the White House china. Trump will not make that mistake.
Ridge
Let’s be clear about the sort of marketing-focus group manipulation going one in the information bubble of red states. The GOP, the shock jocks, and the marketing folks of the major superPACs are not engaging and listening to these citizens any more than to find out how to manipulate their opinions further.
The opportunity comes from no one engaging and listening without an agenda, not the GOP and certainly not the Democratic panderers. Hits to the emotional gizzard on the one hand and smarmy non-serious stereotyping on the other.
That also means that whoever starts to rebuild grassroots politics with the people who are currently wild about Trump will have a major test of trust to undergo. Figuring out how to pass that test will be the most difficult thing in trying to recapture democracy in America.
BTW, those that automatically opposed Obama from the Democratic side of the aisle seemed to slowly disappear in successive midterm elections.
As for the big cardboard checks, getting rid of earmarks got rid of the power to cut the real checks that backed up the big cardboard checks. Bureaucrats now make the choices of where funds go; the trail of causation is much harder to trace than a line at the last minute in a must-pass bill.
Pay-Go is also a deterrent. Don’t think they weren’t tactics that disempowered Democratic elected officials more than Republican ones, who most have to satisfy their major donors wanting lower (no) taxes.
I’m not totally convinced about the effectiveness of the Red Bubble.
Today, spoke to an educated former teacher, who was pro Trump and hoped he would bring positive changes in the coal fields. Then spoke to a lady who lived way back up the hollow with her family. The stereotypical low info, low education voter who was adamantly anti-Trump. Didn’t want anything to do with him or anything with the name on it.
Why one and not the other? I really think its a perception of the economy and what they think the President can do about it. Could also be based on Life experiences. I don’t know but you can’t paint whole regions with broad brushes as we have seen multiple places since the election.
R
Each red state, each red Congressional District, has its pockets of resistance. My sincere hope is that a rebuilding of county parties and fielding candidates up and down the ballot will allow those of us who make up those pockets of resistance to have some influence we currently do not have.
Might find this confirms what you said….http://prospect.org/article/mapping-white-working-class
“The fundamental problem is that white working-class voters do not perceive progressives (or Democrats) to better represent their economic concerns. Polling showed that voters overall divided fairly evenly on whether Donald Trump (46 percent) or Hillary Clinton (42 percent) would do a better job of dealing with the economy, yet Trump enjoyed a 27-point advantage (57 percent to 30 percent) on this question among non-college whites, and an enormous 42-point advantage among non-college white men. This result cannot be explained by Trump’s intermittent economic populism. In 2015, by 73 percent to 27 percent, white working-class voters said that the federal government, far from helping them, had made it harder for them to achieve their goals, and by a 4-to-1 ratio said that the federal government’s economic impact was negative.”
THAT is experiential, and they are not wrong for their cohort. Not in denial, either.
From the location choices of their focus groups, I was prepared to disagree with the article’s thrust. But the more I read, the more I heard repetition of statements and sentiments of those I deal with daily.
I think they have hit on something.
Many of the Moderates (probably not just whites) feel that the politicians don’t know how they live and what their concerns are. HRC pretended that she did. Trump didn’t and gained respect that way.
the system is rigged for the very rich and poor; those in the middle get shat on.
Need for long term, on the ground, engagement of “moderates’ it required to break through their cynicism toward govt. and react favorably toward a “progressive” agenda.
From my personal experiences, I would agree with just about all of this.
R
Those who think they are “in the middle” and getting shat upon are in fact not actually in the middle. And they are delusional if they think the poor are not also being shat on.
As for personal responsibility, sloth might be the sin of the poor (often there are health issues or even mental health issues), but theft is the sin of the middle and those in the middle who avoid being stolen from by the private sector are in fact few. They tolerate that abuse as “just the reality of how markets work” and also tolerate the private theft of public funds through corruption and lobbied deals. But being powerless to do anything about the private sector and about corruption allows them to give those a pass while yammering on and on about taxes. But voting out those politicians who rig taxes to benefit the rich? Never do. And with Trump they explicitly voted in someone who would rig taxes to benefit himself and make their situations worse through austerity.
There are real consequences to policy that soon will become apparent, but the disinformation campaign in red states will make sure that the origins of the pain will never be clearly known. Which creates a positive feedback loop electing and re-electing Republicans as the situation spirals down in a race to the bottom. Places like West Virginia (JFK country in the 1960s) are prototypes of the permanent Republican majority as a result of this positive feedback loop. It is also well along in North Carolina after four years of Pat McCrory.
Some people still do not watch FoxNews or listen to RushBo. For the rest, there are the businesses that keep them on all the time at work and the coffee hour cliques that use the for “ain’t it awful” pastimes. Those nonserious conversations do more damage that just watching the show, as do the preachers who use the shows for sermon topics.
The breakdown of the vote is also a breakdown of the grip of the bubble.
The lady up at the start of the holler would be a good person for a Democratic politician to listen to and to ask how many other people in that holler are like her. Which is my point. Too big shot to get out with ordinary people.
Yes. The donkey is still dead.
And the establishment is still fighting over who gets the taxidermy rights to the corpse.
A hardball campaign for DNC chair. Who is it that cannot admit failure on a massive scale?
The going with the existing red state Senators in leadership positions signals a tilt toward Trumpism.
If I were in Keith Ellison’s situation, I would take my name out of a corrupt selection of leadership. It signals constant sabotage of the progressive wing of the party. In other words, business as usual.
As for the Manchins and McCaskills of the 2018 season, the best thing that could happen is strong primary campaigns that deals with the issues that are real in their states and hits the Trump early errors hard. I don’t know where those sorts of candidates will come from, how they will create competitive primary and general campaigns, and how they will surface those issues in the national consciousness. I just know that putting up those red state Democratic Senators mentioned elects a real Trumpublican who will be even more crazy that the current average for the state. The juggernaut does not stop until someone gets out of their cozy chairs and stops it. That is not where the institutional Democratic Party is at the moment. They are smiling and gladhanding and getting ready to be rolled bigtime.
And Medicare and Social Security are already issues at play. All those folks who voted for Trump probably believed him when he said he’d protect Social Security and Medicare. Yep, just like he’d protect your wives and daughters.
LOL – And the establishment is still fighting over who gets the taxidermy rights to the corpse.
You’re totally right on these points. The DP has signaled how they’re going to manage the next two years. Lefty-Dems have to decide between keeping their powder dry or accepting the risk of pushing back against that which could result even fewer Democrats in office. The lefty political bench is even thinner than the Democratic party political bench. The same situation existed for the teabaggers and that didn’t stop them from finding candidates and not crying in their beer when someone like an Akin lost.
“The lefty political bench is even thinner than the DP political bench.”
BINGO! We need to get to work building up the bench on the state level, like the republicans did. Pete Sessions ran unopposed in his district this year. A district that HRC won bigly. No R. should ever be unopposed, on any level.
There’s enough organization to have a “lefty political bench”?
No. That’s what we need to get to work on. I like the numbers you have as your signature line. We need to be fighting for each and every one of those states, media markets, Congressional districts, counties, precincts, and elected offices.
The things that Karl Rove taught the world about politics that Democrats never learned were:
And right now, the GOP’s strength is gerrymandered districts. We must figure ways to make them lose in the strongest of those districts. In the midst of a media propaganda bubble. The gerrymandering must fail. The 30-year investment in RushBo and FoxNews must fail. Opposition party wins (not necessarily the current Democratic Party, but lefty opposition to Trumpublicanism) must win in places like Kansas, Mississippi, Alabama, Idaho, Wyoming and other places where the GOP’s lock has hurt people.
Only one caveat, Tarheel.
You write:
“Who is it that cannot admit failure on a massive scale?”
I am not entirely convinced that…at least for many in the Dem power hierarchy…the Trump loss is considered to be a “loss.” They did OK for themselves and their families during the Bush I and Bush II years, right? Other Dems did OK under Nixon and Reagan. It’s just a good gig to them. Only the little people actually “lose.”
I like to listen to NYC sports radio stations when I am driving. There is an ongoing meme regarding teams that regularly don’t do very well…the Jets, the Mets (until recently), the Nets, etc.
“The owners don’t care. They’re making money anyway!!!”
Yup.
But the sports fans impotently call and kvetch/kibitz anyway. It’s like…a hobby.
Lots of the players don’t care, either. There’s a wonderful scene in the movie A Bronx Tale where the so-called “goodhearted” gangster is explaining to a young boy who has come under his spell about the realities of baseball. The kid is a big Mickey Mantle fan; his father is a straight, honest bus driver, and the gangster says something to him like “Lissen up, kid. Mickey Mantle don’t care whether you like him or not. No matter what, he’s gonna make more money in a week of work than your father makes pushing a bus around the Bronx for a year. Take of yourself first, alright? Let Mantle take care of himself, too.”
I think this pertains to politics as well. People who are “interested” in politics actually believe the hero-worship rigamarole that they are fed by the media the same way sports fans believe the same hero-worship shit they are fed about sports stars. No amount of loss, of scandal, of damned near anything will disabuse them of this belief in their heroes.
So it goes.
The difference?
Sure.
Short of going broke betting, most sports fans lose very little if their teams don’t do well.
But in politics? They finally wake up only when the the whole house starts to falls down around their heads. And even then, they eventually buy back into the myth just as sports fans do. The owners redouble their media hype, hire a new coach, star or whatever and the con continues.
However, every once in a while the political thing starts to threaten to go way, way off the rails, and when it does you see the essential ugliness that lurks behind real power.
We are at that point today. The first months of a Trump presidency will tell the tale. Eventually the iron fist will come out, and if we have no political party or politicians ready to openly and effectively oppose him we might very well eventually be headed for a Hitler-level collapse.
Just sayin’…I’m doing what little I can to Paul Revere this shit every chance I get. Dunno if it will do much good, but I’m certainly trying. If Ellison succeeds in remaking the DNC into a real political force that opposes Trump instead of some backroom club of personal profit hustlers, i will involve myself in some aspect of what is happening in terms of organization.
Ditto if a new party that shows some possibility of being truly successful arises.
If not?
I will just sit, watch the empire burn and prepare for whatever comes next.
So that goes as well…
AG
“Yes. The donkey is still dead.
And the establishment is still fighting over who gets the taxidermy rights to the corpse.”
I love your skill with words!
Like music…it’s a gift. I take no credit for it. I didn’t “earn” it; it’s just there.
But…how it’s used? For what purposes? That’s a choice.
Of sorts.
My own choices are quite plain.
I do keep trying…
As do you.
AG
Welcome aboard. I certainly don’t mind if a seventy-six year old socialist Jew from Brooklyn saves America, democracy and the world. I hope he gets some help.
Interesting how well the predictions turned out right after the New York primary. 🙁
Lots of anguish and vicious chatter, the pond hasn’t recovered.
You are right.
The pond hasn’t recovered.
Neither has the mainstream Democratic Party that “the pond” still supports…that Booman still supports, for whatever reasons of his own.
So it goes.
AG
History of the Pond
Will your diary reach the 100 comments mark? Haha
Zizek: “Disgusted as I am with Donald Trump, I hope that precisely the shock of electing him will maybe trigger some restructuring of the entire political space.”
Who will do the restructuring, awakening? Not the top DNC, who are basically paid to loose key elections. And not Zizek himself. So we here must be supermen for the humanity.
Precisely.
Thank you.
Thanks to Zizek as well.
It will all work out as it must.
The Marxist warp and woof in action.
How will it work out?
Only the warpers and the woofers are involved in that.
The rest of us?
Even the ones that understand the complexities of the situation? Maybe even more of those than the rest of us?
Time to hunker down and try to survive until the next miraculous awakening.
The Life of Life in action.
Two steps back, one or two to the side, then three steps forward.
Just as it’s always been here on this earth plane.
Just as it’s always been.
AG
Not with “good” Democrats like this they aren’t:
The Hill — Ivanka Trump, children harassed on JetBlue flight
A first rate blog diary
Neofeudalism has arrived
Highly recommend reading it in its entirety and then chewing on it. I’m going to steal “neofeudalism.” More descriptive than how I was describing where we are now.
Let the others waste their time trying to dethrone the new monarch. It’s the barons that have to fall first.